Post-Cabinet Press Conference: Monday, 21 August 2023

All righty, good afternoon, everybody. I’ve had formal notification from King Charles that he has approved the cancellation of James Wallace’s knighthood. I’ve written to James Wallace to advise him accordingly. The Government formally requested that the King cancel Mr Wallace’s appointment as a Knight Companion of the Order of Merit back in June. James Wallace was found guilty and imprisoned for serious crimes, and it is totally inappropriate for him to hold any honour. He can no longer use the title of Sir or KNZM and has been asked to return his warrant of appointment and his honours insignia.

Moving on to other news, we’ve hit two significant milestones that I think the health sector can be incredibly proud of. First, just a month and a half since we abolished the $5 prescription fee, 3 million free prescriptions have already been filled, supporting the health of about 900,000 New Zealanders. Abolishing prescription charges is one of the practical steps that we’ve been taking as a Government to reduce the pressure on family budgets, and Kiwis are already benefiting from that.

Another Government commitment that’s making a big difference is in mental health. Primary health and addiction programme Access and Choice has hit the 1 millionth mental wellbeing support sessions milestone since it started delivering services back in 2020. Primary and early intervention services like Access and Choice just didn’t exist in a major way before 2019. Between 40,000 and 60,000 a month are now being delivered, and that number will continue to grow as the phased nationwide roll-out of services continues. We’ve also put mental health support into schools in large parts of the country through Mana Ake and other programmes. We’ve funded additional mental wellbeing supports in every university and tertiary education institution. That’s the type of progress the Government can make if it sees mental health as a priority, and this Government does.

Another priority that the Government can highlight is the work that we’ve been doing to lift wages across the board and to reduce pay inequality. Last week, official data showed average weekly and hourly wages and salaries have increased by 7.1 and 6.6 percent respectively in the year to June, outstripping inflation over that period. Both are the second-largest annual increases on record, surpassed only by last year’s. Our work to keep Kiwis in work and to increase their pay is delivering for Kiwi workers. Over the past 5½ years, more than 150,000 New Zealanders have also seen their pay increased through pay equity settlements: 156,557 workers across 11 separate settlements have seen pay increases, including 115,000 people working in health. They include 40,000 nurses, who received a 26 percent pay adjustment; and 65,000 care and support workers, who received an extra 27 percent; 22,000 teacher-aides received an extra 25 percent, and 1,300 Oranga Tamariki social workers received a recent pay increase of 30 percent. Others included librarians, clerical staff, community and social workers, and other support workers. All these people are on the front line of our public services, delivering support to New Zealanders. All of them were historically undervalued, and all of them are better off because of this Government’s commitment to investing in public services and in the people who deliver them. There is more work to be done, but recognising these amazing groups of people in this way is an achievement that our Government is incredibly proud of. Valuing people fairly is what Governments can do if it views that as a priority. Now happy to open up for questions.

It’s another smoke and mirrors policy from the National Party. They want to take medicine off one group of New Zealanders in order to give it to another group of New Zealanders. In fact, we need to be increasing the Pharmac budget, but that shouldn’t come at the expense of free prescriptions. We’ve increased the Pharmac budget every year that we have been in Government, and we’ll continue to do that. National, on the other hand, have prioritised tax cuts for millionaires.

Well, as I’ve indicated, there is about 900,000 New Zealanders who have benefited from it so far. Prescriptions are something—it’s a small thing that we can do that helps to keep people healthy, that means that they don’t end up requiring more expensive healthcare. So it’s an incredibly short-sighted decision by the National Party. We’ve increased Pharmac funding every year that we have been in Government. Of course we want to see cancer patients getting access to more treatments.

There are 10 new cancer drugs already that have been funded under our Government because we’ve increased the Pharmac budget to allow them to do that. And it’s our intention to continue to do that, but we think that’s actually a better use of money than tax cuts for millionaires which is what the National Party are prioritising.

I’m not announcing our election health policy today, but I am indicating that increasing funding for Pharmac has been a priority for our Government and if we are re-elected it will continue to be.

Pharmac is a very good model that ensures that we get the best value for money from the money that we spend on medications. We’ve set up the cancer control agency to be an advocate. I note the National Party opposed setting up the cancer control agency and are now using its advice to launch their policy from. I think we need to be careful as politicians about picking and choosing which drugs get funded.

Sorry, in what regard?

I’ve been very clear that increasing funding for Pharmac will continue to be a priority for our Government, but I’m not announcing our health policy today.

Our track record speaks for itself. We’ve invested significantly in our doctors and our nurses. They’ve seen significant pay increases during the time that we’ve been in Government. I’ve encouraged the senior doctors to get back around the bargaining table to find a way forward. We do value the work that our senior doctors do. The best way to resolve the issues that they’re raising is to get back around the bargaining table.

Look, I live in hope. Ultimately, you know, I hope that the doctors will be able to get around the bargaining table and resolve the issues.

This was work that started during the time that I was Minister of Education. We’ve been working on reshaping the curriculum to make sure that the basics, the core basics that every young New Zealand needs, aren’t left to chance, but we’ve been focused on doing that based on evidence of what’s actually going to work. So we’ve had teachers and educational experts developing this work; not politicians in the Beehive. I think what they’ve come up is actually really sound. It’s based on evidence and it will work.

Sorry?

I don’t accept that.

We’ve worked very closely with educational researchers and with the teaching community around the curriculum review to make sure that what we’ve come up with will actually work and it will increase the reading, writing, and maths of our young New Zealanders. If we contrast that with national standards, which were developed in the Beehive without consulting with the education professions, the result was that actually reading, writing, and maths fro that age cohort got worse.

Of course, I don’t want to see any of our medical workforce on strike and I think the best way to resolve those issues is around the bargaining table. I know that Te Whatu Ora will have contingency plans in place should any strike action go ahead, as they always do.

I wouldn’t know, sorry.

And, like I said, I’m not going to bargain publicly with them. The best thing is to get back around the bargaining table.

I don’t want to have senior doctors or any members of the health workforce on strike at any time. I want to have them focused on delivering health care for New Zealanders. That’s why we’ll get around the bargaining table with them in good faith in order to try and resolve any issues that they might be raising.

They’re entitled to their day in court and I’m not going to comment on the court case that’s currently before the courts. But what I would say is that I make no apologies for the fact that our Government is taking steps to crack down on vaping. I don’t want to see a whole generation of young New Zealanders taking up vaping when that can be avoided.

No.

I think we have to look at the reality: that vaping is a good way out of smoking for a lot of people who have previously been smokers. But we have seen an alarming uptick in young New Zealanders who are seeing vaping as an entry, something that—they haven’t been smokers before and they’re taking up vaping. I am concerned about that, and I do think there is more that we can do in that area, and I’ll have more to say on that shortly.

I think this is an area that’s evolved pretty rapidly in the last few years, and so I do think there is more that we need to do.

Well, there’s big money in vaping, so no, I’m not.

I think—well, I’m kind of in a difficult position around commenting on something that we haven’t yet announced, but we are intending—the Labour Party is intending—to take further steps around vaping. I’ve already indicated we’re setting those out tomorrow; so, happy to talk more about that tomorrow.

I absolutely think that reading, writing, and maths are basic foundation skills, but I have made it very clear right the way through the time that I have been Minister, whether Minister of Education or Prime Minister, that we have to make decisions here that are based on evidence of what’s actually going to work. Political tinkering has a real risk associated with it. We saw that with national standards. That was an ideologically driven policy that resulted in reading, writing, and maths getting worse for that generation of young New Zealanders. So we have been focused on making sure that we’re developing something that’s actually going to work.

We made the decision not to roll out significant Curriculum changes during the COVID-19 period. That was for about three years. I stand by that statement and that decision, because, ultimately, I don’t think that our school system was in the right space to be rolling out those sorts of changes during that time.

We made the decision when we were in Opposition that we could develop something in conjunction with the education profession. That’s what we’ve been working on doing. I made the call as Minister of Education, at a time when we were asking schools to deal with lockdowns to deal with significant student and teacher absence because of COVID-

19 circulating in the community, that that wasn’t the time to press ahead more aggressively with that work.

We received the inquiry report into slash that was authored by the Hon Hekia Parata. I think it does provide a good blueprint for a way forward on a lot of the issues that we’re now experiencing. We’ve divided that up. We’ve set out a work plan to deal with those issues, to consider all of the recommendations in the report. We are fast-tracking that work. We want to be able to get some of those things under way as quickly as possible. And so, yes, I think it is something that needs to be urgently dealt with. This problem has built up over many years, and we’re now seeing the outcome of that with more extreme weather that we’re seeing on the coast. And so I think we do need to make sure that we’re fast-tracking the work to get the solutions in place as quickly as possible, bearing in mind that some of that slash has been sitting on those hillsides for some time now.

A National - ACT - New Zealand First Government would be a coalition of chaos, cuts, and confusion. I think New Zealand deserves better?

That’s really a question for him.

Well, clearly, they don’t agree with each other.

Look, I think any governing arrangement with Labour and New Zealand First after the election is a very, very, very, very, very long shot. I’ve said that I’ll set out closer to the campaign our preferred governing arrangements and I will do that.

No, I’ve only seen Winston Peters once since I become Prime Minister, which was at field day. As I think there were a few cameras around at the time. It was an interaction that lasted all of about 90 seconds, where we exchanged pleasantries about the weather.

I have conversations with the Greens all of the time because we actually have a governing arrangement with them at the moment. I haven’t had any specific conversations with Te Paati Māori.

I’ve made a commitment as Prime Minister and also as leader of the Labour Party that I won’t use ethnicity or race as a wedge to divide New Zealanders, and I challenge all other political parties to make that same commitment.

I think international experience shows that we all need to be very eyes wide open when it comes to the potential for foreign interference in our elections. Good guidance has been issued by a variety of different Government agencies to candidates and to parties about what to look out for. And I think there’s a lot of publicly available information for New Zealanders around how they can keep themselves safe in terms of foreign interference or the impact of myth or disinformation.

I think there clearly is more risk and we’ve seen it in other elections around the world, and we need to make sure we keep our eyes wide open to that here in New Zealand.

There’s a range of publicly available information that’s been disclosed and I’m not going to add to that. I actually think that the most appropriate agencies to talk to that are the apolitical agencies. So the intelligence agencies have released some information around foreign interference and what to look out for. I’ll let them speak to that, because, obviously, I am a political actor in this election as well and I have an interest in it. They’re best to speak about what to look out for.

All political parties have, and members of the Intelligence and Security Committee have also received some information.

I don’t think jokes about blowing up a minority are very funny at all.

That’s really a question for him.

New Zealand Treasury is working through the pre-election fiscal update—the PREFU—at the moment. They do that independently of the Government. It’s probably part of the Budget process that we have the least influence over. They do that very independently and they very jealously guard that independence. That will set out the official Government machinery’s view of what the Government’s financial position is going to do over the forecast period and beyond. It sets out a broader horizon as well. Of course, as an incumbent Government, we are very aware of the financial pressure that the Crown accounts are under at the moment.

As part of the regular Budget cycle, we’re always looking for savings. We’re always looking for how we can ensure that we’re delivering taxpayers’ value for money for the taxes that they provide. We’ll continue to do that.

As I’ve said, I’m going to set out a bit closer to the election our preferred governing arrangements, and that’ll set out whether there are any parties that we wouldn’t deal with, for example. But I’m not doing that today.

I’m not setting that out today, Tova.

Well, I’m not going to comment on another media outlet’s polls.

Look, I assume the observation that I did after the event on Saturday—I think that was a handful of people; maybe no more than two dozen who were using loud hailers in order to drown out the voices of the vast majority of people who were at the markets. I think that was really unfortunate for the people who were at the markets who otherwise would have had the opportunity to interact with politicians on the campaign trail, but it is democracy in action, and people are free to, you know, make noise, free to protest, free to share their views. This was Brian Tamaki’s group of people trying to disrupt the election campaign—that’s not exactly new; they’ve been doing that the whole time I’ve been in politics.

The Parliamentary Service have been working with political parties and MPs to ensure that there is extra safety available; you know, there’s extra support available for safety on the campaign trail if it’s required. I think that’s good work; it’s been done cross-party, so there is a mechanism where it’s being done cross-party at the moment, and I think that’s the right way to approach it. It shouldn’t be a political thing. All candidates—regardless of which parties that they’re standing for, whether they’re a current MP or an aspiring MP, should be free to be safe on the campaign trail. They should be free to express their views without the fear that there might be any physical harm to their safety: that’s fundamental in a democracy. So I think that we should continue to not treat this as a partisan issue, we should continue to work across the Parliament to ensure that we can give effect to that.

I didn’t feel unsafe. Obviously, it was disappointing, because there were people who wanted to be able to talk with me and engage with me, and they didn’t get the opportunity to do that because they were drowned out by others.

I’ve done plenty of campaigning out like that in public. I guess it’s the first for this campaign period—

I got a heads-up on the way there that there were some people who had got wind of the fact that we were going to be there and they were going to make some noise. I didn’t feel particularly intimidated by that, but I did feel a bit frustrated for the people who wanted to talk to me.

It’s possible.

I’ve spoken to a number of people about security around the MPs and Ministers on the campaign trail. As I’ve said, those conversations have been happening cross-party, and I think that’s the best way to approach it.

Yes, of course.

I’m concerned about any messaging in the campaign the targets a group of people and really discriminates against a group of New Zealanders. I made a commitment in our campaign that we don’t want to drive a wedge between different groups of New Zealanders; we want to try and bring people together. That’s the sort of campaign that I will be focused on.

I took from that that Māori are concerned about what the outcome of an election might be for Māori. I think they should speak on their own behalf, but I certainly took away a number of messages from Tūrangawaewae in the weekend about how concerned people are about what it might mean for a number of areas of progress we’ve been making; the progress we’ve been making on Māori health, for example. We’re in the early stages of some quite significant progress there to turn around some very important health outcomes for our Māori communities. I think it would be a terrible tragedy if we were to see that go backwards.

No, because I think that that Key-led Government, particularly with the work of people like Christopher Finlayson, was very focused on finding the way forward that unified the country, and I think it’s disappointing that National and ACT have walked away from that.

Sorry, what was that?

We established the school leavers’ tool kit, which is a range of resources for teaching financial literacy in schools. The research that’s been done since we released the school leavers’ tool kit is that some schools are doing this very well and other schools haven’t picked it up, and that’s the reason that we’re going to make it compulsory.

We didn’t make it compulsory the first time, because we didn’t think we would necessarily need to do that. Clearly, the fact that some schools are doing it well and some schools aren’t doing it means that we need to make sure that everybody’s getting access to it.

In terms of the work around driver licensing, that was a commitment we made back in 2017. We’ve done a lot of work on drivers’ licensing that’s been more targeted. I think that’s actually probably the better approach. We didn’t promise that in 2020. That was a 2017 commitment.

We’re not designing our policies to appease millionaires. The National Party are proposing millions of dollars—billions of dollars—of tax cuts that will go to millionaires. The millionaires are therefore funding the National Party. We rely on grassroots contributions. That’s always been the way.

But we’re fund-raising. We always do every election. We’re going to run a very vigorous campaign, and the more people contribute to our campaign, the more vigorous it will be.

I don’t get involved in the fund-raising campaigns.

The conversation we’ve been having with teachers about the New Zealand school curriculum is that we’ve moved from a very prescriptive syllabus previously to a very broad, enabling curriculum. And actually a lot of the feedback we’ve had from teachers is that they want a bit more direction within that curriculum. That’s what we’ve been focused on delivering as a Government.

The current curriculum has been in place since the early 2000s. So it was in place the entire time the National Party were in Government as well. The only major change that we made there was the abolition of national standards, which, as I’ve indicated, weren’t working and, in fact, were making matters worse. We’ve been focused on making sure that we tighten the curriculum. I think that’s the right approach.

Time spent is a very old-fashioned measure for learning, because some kids, if they’ve already gained a skill, don’t need to spend more time on that. You actually want to focus on making sure that you’re adding value for every child in the class. The time-spent measure is that standardised view of thinking about education. It doesn’t work. It is actually going to mean that some kids who are doing well now are robbed of the opportunity to do even better,

As I’ve indicated, we’ve increased Pharmac’s budget every year. We’re not proposing to cut funding for other things in order to fund an increase in funding for Pharmac.

I’m not going to set out our health policy today, but, you know, we will do that in the coming weeks.

We’re certainly not going to be cutting health budgets.

I met with the survivors about a week and a half ago, and, you know, it was a pretty challenging conversation that we had with them, and I really want to thank them for their bravery. I know it’s a really difficult topic even for them to talk about. I don’t think the system has properly supported them through the traumatic ordeal that they have had, so I gave them two commitments: one was to go away and look at the issues that are specific to them where we can provide more support to them; the second was to go away and look at the broader issues around how we support victims in these circumstances. That will take a bit longer, because actually that’s about identifying quite big gaps in the system and how we can best fill them. In terms of the work to support the victims of the LynnMall attack, I’ve indicated that I’ll get back to them with more detail on that within the next two to three weeks. I sent them a letter late last week, just reporting back on progress that I’ve made so far. I want to give them a chance to consider that before I go into the detail of that, but I will make sure that we continue to keep them updated with progress. I do think they’ve waited too long. I do think that they haven’t been as well supported as they should have been, and I’m committed to doing something about that.

I certainly don’t think they received the level of support that they deserved. There could be a whole variety of reasons for why that’s happened, but I want to make sure that we fix that.

I don’t think they’ve met with Ministers previously; I met with them, as I said, about a week and a half ago. That was relatively quickly after they sent a letter to my office asking to meet with me, and that was, I guess, the first opportunity that I had to become aware of the concerns that they had. Many of the concerns that they’ve raised with me are ones that I share. I do think the system hasn’t supported them to the extent that they deserved to have been supported, and I do want to make sure that we put that right.

I don’t think that who uses which bathroom is really an issue that New Zealand is focused on right at the moment. New Zealand First can choose to talk about that if they want to, but I don’t think that it’s the sort of politics that New Zealanders are really engaged in at the moment. I’ve indicated that I will set out—closer to the election, and we’re getting quite close to the election so it won’t be far off—our preferred governing arrangements after the election.

I’ll set a bit more thinking out about that in due course. Thanks everyone.