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Parliamentary debates: Tuesday, 9 December 2025

Contents

The Speaker took the Chair at 2 p.m.

Karakia/Prayers

Teanau Tuiono

Assistant Speaker

E te Atua kaha rawa, ka tuku whakamoemiti atu mātou, mō ngā karakia kua waihotia mai ki runga i a mātou. Ka waiho i ō mātou pānga whaiaro katoa ki te taha. Ka mihi mātou ki te Kīngi, me te inoi atu mō te ārahitanga i roto i ō mātou whakaaroarohanga, kia mōhio ai, kia whakaiti ai tā mātou whakahaere i ngā take o te Whare nei, mō te oranga, te maungārongo, me te aroha o Aotearoa. Amene.

[Almighty God, we give thanks for the blessings which have been bestowed on us. Laying aside all personal interests, we acknowledge the King and pray for guidance in our deliberations, that we may conduct the affairs of this House with wisdom and humility, for the welfare, peace, and compassion of New Zealand. Amen.]

Visitors

Mongolia—State Great Khural

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

I’m sure members would want to join with me to welcome the visiting members of the State Great Khural of Mongolia, including the chair of the Mongolian - New Zealand friendship parliamentary organisation, Mr Erdenebold Sukhbaatar, and their delegation, who are present in the gallery.

Petitions, Papers, Select Committee Reports, and Introduction of Bills

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Six petitions have been delivered to the Clerk for presentation.

Clerk

Petition of Brian Webb requesting that the House require early childhood centres to have cameras that record all interactions between children and caregivers

petition of Before16 charitable trust requesting that the House pass online safety legislation for children that includes a minimum age of 16 for social media access

petition of Mackenzie Dowell requesting that the House require that cosmetics and beauty products list allergens by plain English names rather than scientific names

petition of Nick Ruane requesting that the House urge the Government to increase funding for the Total Mobility scheme

petition of Renee Jens requesting that the House urge the Government to pause the emissions trading scheme for industry and remove the emissions trading scheme for electricity generation

petition of Lily Foster requesting that the House urge the Minister of Education to retain art history for years 12 and 13 students as a standalone subject.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Those petitions stand referred to the Petitions Committee. Ministers have delivered 63 papers.

Clerk

2024-25 annual reports of the:

Accreditation Council

Auckland Light Rail Ltd

Civil Aviation Authority and Aviation Security Service

Classification Office

Commerce Commission

Department of Conservation

Energy Efficiency and Conservation Authority

Fire and Emergency New Zealand

Health and Disability Commissioner

Health New Zealand

Health Quality and Safety Commission

Human Rights Commission

Independent Police Conduct Authority

KiwiRail Holdings Ltd

Te Papa Tongarewa

New Zealand Artificial Limb Service

New Zealand Blood and Organ Service

New Zealand Film Commission

New Zealand Growth Capital Partners Ltd

New Zealand Lottery Grants Board

New Zealand Railways Corporation

New Zealand Trade and Enterprise

Ngarimu VC and the 28th (Māori) Battalion Memorial Scholarship Fund Board

New Zealand Transport Agency

Outdoor Access Commission

Radio New Zealand

Research and Education Advanced Network New Zealand

Reserve Bank of New Zealand

Sport Integrity Commission

Sport New Zealand Group

Takeovers Panel

Te Māngai Pāho

Tertiary Education Commission

Transport Accident Investigation Commission

Tupu Tonu

Whakaata Māori, and

WorkSafe New Zealand.

erratum to the 2024-25 annual reports of the:

Department of Conservation, and the

Parliament Sector

Government responses to the:

petition of Heather Tanguay, and the

petition of Mehnaaz Ali

the Social Services and Community Committee’s report on the petition of Safeguarding Children

the report of the Māori Affairs Committee on the petition of Deborah Chappell, and the

Climate Change Commission’s report on the 2050 target review recommendations

international treaty on the Agreement to Establish the Pacific Resilience Facility, together with the national interest analysis

2025 long-term insights briefing for the Ministry for Culture and Heritage

Reserve Bank of New Zealand’s Monetary Policy Statement for August 2025, Monetary Policy Statement for November 2025, Financial Stability Report for November 2025

2025-29 statements of intent for the:

Health and Disability Commissioner

Human Rights Commission

New Zealand Lotteries Commission, and

WorkSafe New Zealand

2025-26 statements of performance expectations for the:

Health and Disability Commissioner

Health New Zealand

Health Quality and Safety Commission

Human Rights Commission

Te Papa Tongarewa

New Zealand Artificial Limb Service

New Zealand Blood and Organ Service

New Zealand Film Commission

Sport Integrity Commission

Sport New Zealand Group, and

Tupu Tonu

State of the Public Service 2025.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Those papers are published under the authority of the House. Twenty-four select committee reports have been delivered for presentation.

Clerk

Reports of the Economic Development, Science and Innovation Committee on the:

Anti-Money Laundering and Countering Financing of Terrorism (Supervisor, Levy, and Other Matters) Amendment Bill

review briefing on the 2023-24 annual review of Crown Regional Holdings Ltd

review briefing on the 2023-24 annual review of Landcare Research New Zealand Ltd

review briefing on the 2023-24 annual review of the Real Estate Agents Authority

reports of the Education and Workforce Committee on the:

Employment Relations Amendment Bill, and the

petition of Katherine Lamont

report of the Environment Committee on the Fast-track Approvals Amendment Bill

reports of the Governance and Administration Committee on the:

Local Government (System Improvements) Amendment Bill

Online Casino Gambling Bill, and the

Public Service Amendment Bill

reports of the Health Committee on the:

briefing from Arthritis New Zealand

Healthy Futures (Pae Ora) Amendment Bill, and the

inquiry into the aged care sector’s current and future capacity to provide support services for people experiencing neurological cognitive disorders

reports of the Justice Committee on the:

Constitution Amendment Bill

Electoral Amendment Bill, and the

report of the Ombudsman OPCAT Report: Report on an examination of the Prisoners of Extreme Risk Unit under the Crimes of Torture Act 1989

report of the Māori Affairs Committee on the briefing on accountability settings and outcomes for Māori

reports of the Petitions Committee on the:

petition of Christina Gillmore

petition of Miriam Woon, and the

petition of Summer Fraser

report of the Regulations Review Committee on the Secondary Legislation Confirmation Bill (No 3)

reports of the Transport and Infrastructure Committee on the:

petition of New Zealand Equestrian Advocacy Network

report of the Controller and Auditor-General Regulating vehicle safety inspections, and the

review briefing on the 2023-24 annual review of Meridian Energy Ltd

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

The bills are set down for second reading. The reports of the Controller and Auditor-General and the Ombudsman, the inquiry briefings, etc., and the review briefings are set down for consideration. The Clerk has been informed of the introduction of nine bills.

Clerk

Crimes Amendment Bill, introduction

Climate Change Response (2050 Target and Other Matters) Amendment Bill, introduction

Public Works Amendment Bill, introduction

Infrastructure Funding and Financing Amendment Bill, introduction

Arms Bill, introduction

Natural Environment Bill, introduction

Planning Bill, introduction

Emergency Management Bill (No 2), introduction

Commerce (Promoting Competition and Other Matters) Amendment Bill, introduction.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Those bills are set down for first reading.

Urgent Debates Declined

Public Statements Regarding Former Deputy Commissioner of Police

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Members, I’ve received a letter from Mariameno Kapa-Kingi seeking to debate under Standing Order 399 public statements by the former Commissioner of Police and both the former and current Ministers of Police regarding former Deputy Commissioner Jevon McSkimming. Urgent debates are a way of holding the current Government accountable for an action for which it is responsible, so an urgent debate cannot be held on matters for which a previous Government had some responsibility. Urgent debates are not a means through which to discover what a Minister knew or why they said something; that is the role of parliamentary questions. The application is declined.

Oral Questions

Questions to Ministers

Question No. 1—Prime Minister

1. Prime Minister

Chris Hipkins

Labour Party · Remutaka

Leader of the Opposition

to the Prime Minister

Does he stand by all his Government’s statements and actions?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Yes. [Disturbance in gallery]

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

To our friends in the gallery, that was an impromptu performance—a little bit of poetry and lots of performative art as well. I think we’ll now progress to questions for oral answer.

Chris Hipkins

Labour Party · Remutaka

Who actually speaks for the Government: the Prime Minister, who says that he wants “modest, consistent house price increases”, or the Housing Minister, Chris Bishop, who says the Government is “trying to drive house prices down”?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

What this Government doesn’t want is a 30 percent growth in house prices in a single year, as we experienced under the last Government. House prices have come down, I think about 13 percent on average. What we want to see is gradual, moderate, consistent house price growth, while we want to see wage growth obviously growing faster than house price appreciation.

Chris Hipkins

Labour Party · Remutaka

Was Chris Bishop wrong when he said only recently that the Government was “trying to drive house prices down”?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

What this Government is doing is we are radically increasing the supply of land available for housing, and I would just say to that member, I would put our record on housing up against his any day of the week, because housing is more affordable for purchase; rentals—[Interruption] Just remember, house prices went up 30 percent in a single year under Labour. Rents went up $180 a week. There is 5,000 fewer people now on social housing waitlists under this Government; kids are out of motel rooms, and, actually, this Government’s record on housing beats his record any day of the week.

Chris Hipkins

Labour Party · Remutaka

When Nicola Willis said, “I agree with him that house prices need to fall; I’m with him.”, was she admitting that her alignment on housing policy is with Chris Bishop and not the Prime Minister?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

This is a country that has been experiencing a housing crisis for many, many years, and it’s a function of having not enough supply in the market. It is not a demand-side problem, it’s a supply-side problem, and that’s why I’m very proud of what this Government is doing, launching its new Resource Management Act reforms today to make sure that we can actually get more houses built for New Zealanders. I think that member should be thankful that we have actually done a good job of making sure house price affordability is down—that’s a good thing. Rentals are down—that’s a good thing—not up $180 a week. We’ve got 5,000 fewer families on the social housing wait-list now in housing. We’ve got 3,000 kids and families out of emergency housing. I’m proud of our record on housing.

David Seymour

ACT Party · Epsom

Is it the Government’s desire that wages grow faster than house prices, and that requires sound economic management from this Government?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Absolutely. That’s what I was saying in answer to the first question, which is that we want to see wage growth, income growth, be faster and higher than house price growth so it becomes more affordable.

Chris Hipkins

Labour Party · Remutaka

What is the Government’s policy position: his position that the Government wants “modest, consistent house price increases”; Chris Bishop’s position, where he says the Government is “trying to drive house prices down”; or Nicola Willis’ position, where she says that she agrees with Chris Bishop that house prices need to fall?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Our position is to unlock growth in this country, to open up more land available for housing so it becomes more affordable. We’re not interested in KiwiBuild—remember that one? It didn’t go so good. What we’re interested in doing is systemic reform of our planning laws so that we can get more houses built so they become more affordable for people.

Chris Hipkins

Labour Party · Remutaka

Is his reluctance to answer the question on whether he speaks for the Government on house prices, or Chris Bishop or Nicola Willis speak for the Government on house prices, because he’s not sure whether they do actually support his position?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

I think the bigger question the member should be concerned about is: what’s happening with house prices? They are more affordable under this Government in two years than they were under his Government in six years. What’s the situation with rentals? They went up $180 a week under his Government; they’ve come down under this Government. When you think about the position on social housing, we actually have 5,000 fewer families now on a social housing wait-list, and that is a good thing. We’ve got 3,200 families out of emergency hotels, where they were sitting, now in houses, and we’re also supporting the homeless as well. I line up our record on every dimension, every component, any day of the week. [Interruption]

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

I appreciate that members will be a little unsettled due to the theatrics we experienced at the beginning of question time, but you do have to keep it reasonable.

Chris Hipkins

Labour Party · Remutaka

Is he not calling out Chris Bishop for contradicting him on falling house prices and not calling out Nicola Willis for saying that she’s with Chris Bishop on falling house prices because he’s worried that Nicola Willis is also going to end up with Chris Bishop when he tries to replace him as Prime Minister?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

No. Look, I’ll just say, I think the member should worry less about the National Party and worry about his mates in the Greens and Te Pāti Māori, don’t you think? I think that’s what you should be worrying about, son.

Question No. 2—RMA Reform

2. RMA Reform

Catherine Wedd

National Party · Tukituki

to the Minister responsible for RMA Reform

What announcement has he made about replacing the Resource Management Act 1991?

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

The Hon Chris Bishop. [Interruption] Just hang on. Let him at least get a couple of words out.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

Today, the Government has announced its new planning system to replace the Resource Management Act 1991 to make it easier to build the homes and infrastructure our country needs, give farmers and growers the freedom to get on with producing world-class food and fibre, and strengthen our primary sector while protecting the environment. The Resource Management Act 1991 has been a failure. It’s slowed down energy and infrastructure projects and has fuelled a housing crisis in a country the size of the United Kingdom but with only 7 percent of its population. It’s created uncertainty for developers, councils, farmers, and growers, yet hasn’t protected the environment. The reforms announced today are a once-in-a-generation opportunity to free ourselves from a millstone that has weighed on both our economy and our environment. Of course, the foundation of the new regime is the centrepiece of liberal democracies: property rights.

Catherine Wedd

National Party · Tukituki

What are the major features of the new system?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

The system will need fewer and simpler consents, with fewer activity categories, so low-impact activities no longer require consents. We will move from over 100 existing plans to 17 regional combined plans integrating spatial land use and natural environment planning. Spatial planning means 30-year regional spatial plans to identify growth areas, infrastructure corridors, and areas needing protection. There will be clearer national direction and more consistency through nationally set policy direction, and the system will be more proportionate—consent conditions must be necessary and proportionate, reducing red tape.

Catherine Wedd

National Party · Tukituki

What other major features are there?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

The new planning system will include more standardisation; planned national standards on zoning and common activities will cut red tape and speed up the system; consultation will only occur where necessary; councils will also be required to provide practical relief mechanisms when imposing restrictions on heritage and on things like significant natural areas; a new planning tribunal will deliver faster, low-cost conflict resolution; and it will mean better environmental protection, enabling community decision-making over water quality and improving the efficient use of resources.

Catherine Wedd

National Party · Tukituki

What does this mean for New Zealanders?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

This all adds up to an easier, cheaper system. It means less paperwork, less cost, and faster and easier progress for those who want to do basic things like putting a deck on a house, building a fence on a farm, constructing some townhouses, or even—even, Marama Davidson—a wind farm. This means a planning system that works for New Zealanders and their aspirations rather than against them. More land will be unlocked for housing. Long-term spatial plans will give investors certainty. For farmers, it means less red tape; farm plans to manage environmental risks. It means making planning simpler, faster, and fairer so we can build homes, grow food, farm animals, and deliver the infrastructure that New Zealand needs while caring for the environment. If we get this right, the 2030s can be New Zealand’s decade.

Simon Court

ACT Party · List MP

How is introducing a regulatory relief mechanism for property owners—subject to significant natural areas, heritage, culture, and landscape overlays—strengthening private property rights?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

I thank the Parliamentary Under-Secretary for his excellent question. I’ll just reflect on the fact that at the moment, it is costless for councils to impose quite significant controls on private property. I think about my own electorate of Hutt South, where the council imposed significant natural areas, in some cases on 70 to 80 to 90 percent of people’s private land, thus diminishing the value of that land and what they could do with that land. That was costless for the council but comes at real cost for people and their private property rights. We are tilting the balance back in favour of property rights by requiring councils to actually think about those things and think about offering regulatory relief in those circumstances. Individual cases and individual councils will vary, but, clearly, there is a shift in balance back towards the idea of private property.

Simon Court

ACT Party · List MP

How does introducing a planning tribunal strengthen the rights of property owners?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

Many members of this House will have experienced people who have approached them who are having arguments with their local council about, often, quite simple things. Again, I think of my own electorate and a man who was arguing for nine months with the local council about replacing the garage on his house or on his property, where there was an existing garage, and the council didn’t like the design of the new garage. Again, almost every member of this House will have examples of people who’ve approached them complaining about similar experiences. Now, at the moment, you can go and complain to the council, who’s creating the problem in the first place, or you can go off to the Environment Court at vast expense, time, and money. The planning tribunal sits between the council and the Environment Court and will be like the Disputes Tribunal, which will offer low-cost access to justice for people who are being screwed over by councils. Of course, the whole point is that there will be less ability for councils to do that, because the system will manage fewer things in the first place.

Question No. 3—Finance

3. Finance

Barbara Edmonds

Labour Party · Mana

to the Minister of Finance

Does she agree with the Prime Minister’s comments about asset sales that “we’d take it to the election, and it would be part of our programme”; if so, what advice, if any, has she received on the Crown’s ownership interest in State-owned companies?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister of Finance

I agree with the Prime Minister’s full quote, which was: “We take it to the election and it would be part of our programme that we’d want to talk about and be upfront with New Zealanders about. The Government is not selling State assets this term.” As Minister of Finance, my job is to ensure the Crown’s half-trillion-dollar asset base is working for New Zealand. What we are doing is asking whether the assets we own are performing and how we can get better value for taxpayers. When the Government took office in November 2023, Treasury proactively advised in its briefing to incoming shareholding and responsible Ministers that Ministers should consider being clearer about the purposes of the Crown’s ownership of several Government-owned companies. Treasury noted that “OECD guidelines recommend that countries also set out an ‘ownership policy statement’, and many OECD countries do so,”. Shareholding Ministers accepted Treasury’s suggestion and have been receiving advice on the ownership purposes of a number of Crown-owned companies. This advice has not been considered by Cabinet.

Barbara Edmonds

Labour Party · Mana

Has she requested any further advice on options to sell State-owned assets?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister of Finance

Well, as I’ve said, we are evaluating the Crown balance sheet, which I would point out Crown companies are a very small portion of. New Zealanders collectively own many assets, which are social assets—schools, hospitals, houses, roads. I would point out to the member that it is the case, for example, that on our watch, Kāinga Ora has sold many multimilliondollar homes in Ponsonby and Herne Bay so that they can reuse the proceeds to build homes in areas of highest need. Similarly, under the last Government, Kiwibank sold Kiwi Wealth, releasing $225 million in capital to improve its growth prospects, potentially increasing lending to New Zealanders by 14 percent.

Kieran McAnulty

Labour Party · List MP

Point of order, sir. The question was a relatively straightforward one: has she sought any additional advice? We are none the wiser as to whether that is the case. That particular aspect of the question was not addressed by that long answer.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Well, I think the start was by saying what the Government has decided to do. You can go around this stuff for ever, but, you know, have another supplementary.

Barbara Edmonds

Labour Party · Mana

Are all Associate Ministers of Finance receiving all the advice on the ownership interest in State-owned assets; if not, why not?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister of Finance

That would depend on the advice. But as I made very clear in my answer to the primary question, all advice will be taken to Cabinet, and Cabinet collectively will make decisions about the ownership statements. That has not yet occurred.

Barbara Edmonds

Labour Party · Mana

Is it an appropriate use of public sector resources to do the groundwork on asset sales, given the Government has ruled out asset sales this term?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister of Finance

Well, I utterly reject that assertion. The member is confusing basic financial stewardship with privatisation, because, unlike the previous Government, we take seriously our role as stewards of public assets, and we believe it is in the interests of New Zealand taxpayers to ensure they are performing well and to their purpose. Where they are not performing well or to their purpose, you can bet we will be holding their boards and chairpeople to account for lifting that performance on behalf of New Zealanders. You sat back—

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

No, no, that’s enough—that’s enough.

Barbara Edmonds

Labour Party · Mana

Will she rule out asset sales while she is Minister of Finance?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister of Finance

The Crown has made very clear that we will not be selling Crown companies this term. What I’ve also made clear is that it is the case that we have, for example, sold multimillion-dollar homes previously owned by Kāinga Ora so that we can recycle that capital into better-value homes for people in need. This is consistent with the practice of the previous Government, which also did the same thing, selling assets owned by Kāinga Ora to put the dollars to better purposes. It’s also the case that within entities that the Crown owns, from time to time they will divest some of their assets in order to better recycle that capital, as is the primary example: Kiwi Wealth, a $225 million asset owned by Kiwibank, sold by the previous Government—

Chris Hipkins

Labour Party · Remutaka

Not true.

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister of Finance

—with the proceeds recycled to Kiwi Wealth. Mr Hipkins says that’s not true. I can assure him the statements I make in this House are accurate. [Interruption]

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Hang on, hang on—question being asked.

Barbara Edmonds

Labour Party · Mana

How many homes has she funded and built this year from the recycling of the funding from the sales she mentioned in her previous response?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister of Finance

That’s a question probably both better put to the Minister of Housing and better put in writing, but what I can confirm is that on this Government’s watch, we have delivered more social homes in our first two years in office than the last Government did in three.

Kieran McAnulty

Labour Party · List MP

Why must she lie? Every time she lies about this.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Hang on, hang on—that will see you leaving the House.

Kieran McAnulty

Labour Party · List MP

Well, I’m happy to stand by that, so I’m not going to retract it.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Well, if you’re going to stand by it, then you’re going to get yourself in a lot of trouble. Think of another way of putting it.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Can the Minister of Finance confirm that the proceeds from the sale of the house in Trinity Street, Ponsonby, next to Lorde’s mansion, has funded the retrofit of six to seven other Kāinga Ora properties in Auckland?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister of Finance

I can confirm that. What I am surprised to also have to confirm to members of this House today is that there are some members here who would prefer we sat on those multimillion-dollar homes in a very expensive part of Auckland than deliver more homes for families in need. I stand by our Government’s decisions.

David Seymour

ACT Party · Epsom

Is the Minister of Finance aware of any other investor that’s been around for 170 years, like the New Zealand Government, that only ever buys and never sells to get a better deal?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister of Finance

As the Deputy Prime Minister rightly points out, that would be the worst sort of financial stewardship, and it is a reflection on the economic capability of others if they’re to suggest that we should never, ever decide that an asset is no longer serving taxpayers to its best purpose. It has been the case of successive Governments that they assess the value of assets and how they are performing.

Question No. 4—Prime Minister

4. Prime Minister

Chlöe Swarbrick

Green Party · Auckland Central

Co-Leader

to the Prime Minister

E tautoko ana ia i ngā kōrero me ngā mahi katoa a tōna Kāwanatanga?

[Does he stand by all of his Government’s statements and actions?]

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Yes.

Chlöe Swarbrick

Green Party · Auckland Central

Will the Prime Minister take responsibility for rough sleeping in Auckland nearly doubling between September 2024 and May 2025, during which his Government’s emergency housing changes came into effect?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Well, as we’ve discussed before in the House, I’m very, very proud of this Government’s progress on removing and getting rid of emergency housing in motels. We’ve been able to move families and kids into dry, warm homes. This is also a Government that cares deeply about the challenges of homelessness, and as that member well understands, they saw an increase in homelessness of 37 percent after spending a billion dollars when they were in Government. It’s a complex issue. We’re doing everything we can to work on that, too.

Chlöe Swarbrick

Green Party · Auckland Central

Does he accept the community organisation’s concerns reflected in the open letter which I passed him before question time today began that Government choices to cut access to emergency housing, cancel State housing developments, cut funding for rangatahi housing support, and weaken tenants’ rights are directly linked to more Aucklanders sleeping in our streets, our parks, and their cars?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

As we’ve talked to before, we have actually met with key stakeholders in Auckland’s CBD to see what more we can be doing around the homeless situation there. These are complex issues, with people with complex needs, but this also a Government that has opened up 300 more Housing First places, we’ve got 200 of them going into Auckland, and we also now are talking to the NGOs that we partner with to make sure that they are doing everything they can to make sure they are managing vacancies and vacancy management within their own system, by which, of course, the Government is working with them and providing them with contracts to do so. There is a concerted effort to do everything that we can. But I’d just ask the member to stop and reflect on the fact that we have 5,000 fewer families on a wait-list waiting to get access to a State house or a community housing provided house. We have 3,000 families out of emergency housing in motels after that being a systemic problem for a long period of time, and we should be very proud about that.

Chlöe Swarbrick

Green Party · Auckland Central

Can he guarantee that every single New Zealander experiencing rough sleeping can access emergency housing or whatever support they may need if they were, today, to walk into a Work and Income office?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

As we’ve talked before, this is a Government that has actually put together 300 more Housing First places; 200 of them are available in Auckland, and we’re also now getting the NGOs to record their vacancy rates daily and weekly so that we can make sure that they are actually delivering those dwellings and that accommodation for those people that need it. But we’ve also put in place $10 million of additional funding for support services for rough sleepers.

Chlöe Swarbrick

Green Party · Auckland Central

Can he guarantee that every New Zealander who is currently experiencing rough sleeping could today walk into a Work and Income office and get access to the emergency housing and support services that they need?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Well, as the member is aware, and we’ve talked about in recent weeks, we’ve also directed the Ministry of Social Development to show greater discretion to support people who are in need. But I’d just say to the member again, when you see housing affordability at the best it’s been in a long period of time, when you see rents coming down, when you see people off a social housing wait-list, when you see people out of emergency accommodation in motels, and you also see support with 300 more Housing First places, $10 million available for rough sleepers, and coordination between Government and key agencies, that’s good work.

Chlöe Swarbrick

Green Party · Auckland Central

Will the Prime Minister rule out the much-discussed move-on orders, which community providers have said will result in them struggling to reach homeless rangatahi in Auckland when they are pushed out to further suburbs and afraid to enter the city centre, where the services are?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Again, as we’ve discussed this before, the Minister for Auckland has met with other key Ministers and agencies. There is a six-point plan, developed in conjunction with Auckland Council and the Government and others, about housing for rough sleepers. We want increased police and council presence. We want safer public spaces, targeting of criminal behaviour, targeted support services, and cleaner streets. Yes, we are exploring move-on orders, and we’ll have more to say about that shortly.

Question No. 5—Oceans and Fisheries

5. Oceans and Fisheries

Andy Foster

NZ First Party · List MP

to the Minister for Oceans and Fisheries

What reports has he received on the fisheries sector?

Shane Jones

NZ First · List MP

Minister for Oceans and Fisheries

I have received a report that shows 87 percent of our stocks, according to a scientific analysis, are definitely sustainable, and it’s backed up by the United Nations. We should remember that over 9,000 people are employed in this sector—$1.5 billion in exports—and despite the best efforts of my critics, the furry Luddites, we stand strong with this industry.

Andy Foster

NZ First Party · List MP

How will the fisheries reforms help sustainability and increase the value of fisheries?

Shane Jones

NZ First · List MP

Minister for Oceans and Fisheries

Earlier this year we announced some reforms that will make their way through Parliament during the course of next year. Of course, it’s important that we have balance and that when catch limits for our various species of fish are set, it’s driven by science. But also we stand against the demonisation and the tainting of the commercial fishing sector. The rules that will be put in place via our upcoming reforms will be consultative, but they will also enhance science to ensure that sectors seeking to taint this important sector do not get a free pass.

Andy Foster

NZ First Party · List MP

What actions has the Minister taken to increase exports from the aquaculture sector?

Shane Jones

NZ First · List MP

Minister for Oceans and Fisheries

Our Government has, during the course of our rule, as a consequence of far-sighted voters in 2023, extended marine farming permits by 20 years. This enabled the industry and the holders of those permits to dedicate capital, take a risk, and grow the footprint of aquaculture in New Zealand. It has been a key improver in terms of productivity, and we will be working very closely as a Government in a cohesive fashion to ensure that the Resource Management Act (RMA) reforms identified today do deliver for coastal-based industries.

Andy Foster

NZ First Party · List MP

How will those Resource Management Act reforms support the aquaculture sector?

Shane Jones

NZ First · List MP

Minister for Oceans and Fisheries

The RMA, as our colleague Minister Bishop stated, is broken. It has become a major drain on productivity. It will provide an opportunity for people to go about their business, celebrate the fact that they have property rights that can be utilised to grow the wealth of the country. We will also ensure that the Coastal Policy Statement, a failed attempt to balance the needs of the coast, does not continue and blight the development opportunities, and ensure that ports, aquaculture, and other related matters continue to grow. I look forward to the submissions that may come from the industry through the select committee process, as I am aware that they hope to see one day a bespoke aquaculture type of legislative outcome to grow that industry.

Question No. 6—Prime Minister

6. Prime Minister

Rawiri Waititi

Te Pāti Māori · Waiariki

Co-Leader

to the Prime Minister

Does he stand by all his Government’s statements and actions?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Yes.

Rawiri Waititi

Te Pāti Māori · Waiariki

Did he or the Minister of Police have any knowledge of allegations made against former deputy police commissioner Jevon McSkimming before 6 November 2024?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

In answer to myself, no.

Rawiri Waititi

Te Pāti Māori · Waiariki

Did he have any knowledge of the allegations made against his former deputy chief press secretary Michael Forbes before June 2025?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

No.

Rawiri Waititi

Te Pāti Māori · Waiariki

Were these cases examples of police negligence, or were he and his Ministers being wilfully ignorant to the behaviour of their high-ranking colleagues?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

No, I’m very proud of the police. I think the 15,000 men and women of the police force do an amazing job each and every day. I’m very proud of the work that they’ve done in undertaking to remove 38,000 serious and violent criminals from New Zealand—the number of victims of serious and violent crime has been down. I’m very proud of the fact that they’ve got a 16 percent lower level of serious youth offending. Yes, we have 1,900 more people in prison, but they’re not out in the community causing pain and suffering to fellow New Zealanders.

Rawiri Waititi

Te Pāti Māori · Waiariki

Will he commit to initiating a royal commission of inquiry into the New Zealand Police in response to these obvious failures to identify serious misconduct?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

No, because this Government has moved incredibly quickly to the outcome of what a royal commission of inquiry would generate anyway, which is the strongest statutory oversight mechanism possible, which is, of course, an inspector-general.

Question No. 7—Health

7. Health

Ayesha Verrall

Labour Party · List MP

to the Minister of Health

Does he stand by all his actions in the health portfolio; if not, why not?

David Seymour

ACT Party · Epsom

Associate Minister of Health

On behalf of the Minister of Health, yes, particularly the action of setting targets for delivery in the healthcare system. For too long before this Government was formed, Government and Ministers tended to show their aroha for the patient by throwing money at the problem rather than setting targets for productivity in order to actually get people the results, the vaccinations, and the appointments they need in a timely manner, which is this Government’s action.

Ayesha Verrall

Labour Party · List MP

Which action does he stand by: his cuts to graduate nursing roles or his partial reversal of those cuts?

David Seymour

ACT Party · Epsom

Associate Minister of Health

I can’t speak to the Minister’s allegations, which seem to be more of an attempt at making social media. What I can say is this Government has hired 2,000 additional nurses. I don’t know if the member’s ever seen 2,000 additional nurses in one place, but that’s a lot of nurses.

Ayesha Verrall

Labour Party · List MP

Does he stand by his plan for digital investment or his unsafe cuts to hospitals’ digital systems?

David Seymour

ACT Party · Epsom

Associate Minister of Health

I absolutely, on behalf of the Minister, stand by this Government’s plan to invest in digitisation. The reason for that: I happened, in my own capacity, to be visiting Waikato Hospital a time ago, and they explained to me that as an Aucklander, if I was to be in a car crash in Hamilton, I would need to have my records emailed from Auckland, potentially while I was bleeding out on the table. I asked them, “Didn’t the previous Government merge the DHBs together?”, and they said, “Well, that was just the letterheads. They didn’t do the hard work of investing in a patient record.” That’s what this Government is doing, and, yes, I stand by that—yes, I do.

Ayesha Verrall

Labour Party · List MP

Does he stand by decisions to centralise hiring outside of local hospitals, causing months of delay to doctors’ recruitment?

David Seymour

ACT Party · Epsom

Associate Minister of Health

It is certainly true that under the previous Government’s centralisation and merger of the DHBs, the hiring of staff had to be routed through Wellington, leading to enormous delays. The Minister of Health has reversed that change and decentralised hiring so that the people at the coalface can make the decisions about who to hire. That is actually an improvement, and I’m starting to wonder if this member is trying to make the Government look good.

Ayesha Verrall

Labour Party · List MP

Is it the case that the Minister is unaware that that decision to centralise hiring outside of hospitals, as well as the cuts to nursing graduate roles and digital infrastructure, were all under that Government?

David Seymour

ACT Party · Epsom

Associate Minister of Health

That is simply untrue, and the simple facts are 2,000 extra nurses, 600 extra doctors. You can’t argue with results.

Question No. 8—Economic Growth

8. Economic Growth

Cameron Brewer

National Party · Upper Harbour

to the Minister for Economic Growth

What impact will resource management reform have on the economy?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister for Economic Growth

For too long, the Resource Management Act (RMA) has been a handbrake on the New Zealand economy. It has created costs and complexity, headaches and confusion. It has stifled growth and competition, and the changes Minister Bishop announced today will release that handbrake. To improve living standards, create jobs, and lift incomes, New Zealand needs to stop saying no and start staying yes—yes to investment, yes to innovation, and yes to growth. That’s what these changes are all about: making it easier, faster, and cheaper, whether you’re building a deck or a wind farm.

Cameron Brewer

National Party · Upper Harbour

How will these changes improve economic performance?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister for Economic Growth

The changes the Government has announced today will improve economic performance in three main ways. First, they will lower the costs at each step of the planning system—in fact, reducing dramatically the number of circumstances in which a consent will even be required. This will put a stop to the gravy train of consultants and lawyers that has characterised the RMA. They will help ensure that New Zealand’s scarce resources are being used in the most valuable way they can, and they will establish a more flexible and enabling system that promotes innovation, investment, and adaptation. Together with other reforms from this Government, these changes will help lift New Zealand’s productivity, reduce regulatory burdens, and get the economy growing.

Cameron Brewer

National Party · Upper Harbour

What effect will these changes have on costs?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister for Economic Growth

The changes announced today will generate administrative and compliance savings for all participants in the resource management system—users of the system, of course, but also local and central government. From the mum and dad wanting to renovate their home, through to the farmer wanting to grow vegetables for our plates, fewer activities will require consents in the future. I am advised that close to half of consent applications may become unnecessary. There will be fewer hearings, fewer appeals, fewer delays, and economic consultants Castalia have calculated that the net administrative and compliance benefits, in present value terms, will amount to $13 billion over the next 30 years.

Cameron Brewer

National Party · Upper Harbour

What wider effects will these changes have?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister for Economic Growth

Of course, cost savings are just one part of a bigger story. Most importantly, projects that under the current system would be delayed, deferred, or not happen at all, despite those with capital eager to get started and make things happen, will in the future go ahead in a timely way. There are huge benefits, for example, for making housing supply more responsive to demand. Instead of tying up, in court, proposals for new houses for New Zealanders, the new law will make it faster for them to get built. There are huge benefits from infrastructure projects in low-risk locations proceeding at a greater pace and scale than they are now, not tied up in the current multiyear delays which have plagued so many Government transport projects. The complexity and uncertainty of the current resource management rules is costing New Zealand in terms of growth, incomes, and opportunities. The changes that Minister Bishop announced today will get things moving again.

Question No. 9—Social Development and Employment

9. Social Development and Employment

Ginny Andersen

Labour Party · List MP

to the Minister for Social Development and Employment

Does she stand by her statement, “Our Government does not accept that a life on welfare is as good as it gets for our young people”; if so, why?

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Minister for Social Development and Employment

Yes, and we know that people under the age of 25 on the jobseeker benefit are estimated to spend another two decades on a benefit over their lifetimes. Our Government has far greater hopes and aspirations for young Kiwis than a life on welfare, and we make no apologies for encouraging them into education, further training, or employment. That’s why we are delivering more early intervention, clearer expectations, and stronger partnerships with employers to help more people move from welfare into work. We’ve seen over 26,000 young people leave welfare for work in the last 12 months. The steps we are taking will put New Zealand and young New Zealanders on a better path.

Ginny Andersen

Labour Party · List MP

Why did she launch her community coaching pilot at Youth Inspire in the Hutt Valley, which helps young people into work, and then subsequently cut their funding?

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Minister for Social Development and Employment

Well, as I said in the annual review last week to that member, the Ministry for Social Development (MSD) runs their procurement basis, as most Government agencies do, on the all-of-Government procurement guidelines, and when they go out to tender for services and for products, they want to make sure that what they are purchasing delivers Government outcomes and also provides value for money.

Ginny Andersen

Labour Party · List MP

What are the other programmes that have been funded by MSD in the Hutt Valley to specifically support young people into employment?

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Minister for Social Development and Employment

Well, what I would say is that the provider that is going to be providing the youth job coaching in the Hutt Valley will be announced in the coming weeks, and, as I said to that member, we have great providers all over New Zealand who are doing fantastic work with young people. That’s why 26,000 young people in the last year alone have exited from welfare into work.

Ginny Andersen

Labour Party · List MP

Does she agree with Chris Bishop, who said that “Youth Inspire do a great job in our community”; if so, why did they have their funding cut when they are the only provider in the area that supports young people into employment?

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Minister for Social Development and Employment

Well, the member is completely wrong. There are other services in the Hutt Valley that deliver services to young people, whether it’s driver licensing or the youth coaching that is up for renegotiation. What that member fails to realise is that Youth Inspire will continue to have contracts available through MSD.

Ginny Andersen

Labour Party · List MP

What message does it send to young people when she cuts the only programme in the Hutt that gives young people the skills and confidence to get a job, and even the local National MP is at a loss as to why their funding has been cut?

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Minister for Social Development and Employment

Well, the member is just blatantly wrong. There are other service providers in the Hutt. MSD has run—

Ginny Andersen

Labour Party · List MP

Name them—name them.

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Minister for Social Development and Employment

—a programme, and the programme provider that will be replacing the youth coaching will be announced in the coming weeks—so, no, I’m not going to do MSD’s job in announcing—

Ginny Andersen

Labour Party · List MP

They’re not youth.

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Minister for Social Development and Employment

—who they have procured the services from.

Ginny Andersen

Labour Party · List MP

We know who they are, and they’re not youth.

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Minister for Social Development and Employment

They are—they are absolutely, because when a procurement is reissued, it is based on the services that MSD is buying. They are buying job coaching for young people. I’m really proud of the work MSD do all over New Zealand. I accept that for individual providers, it’s challenging when they have a change to their contract, and I’m really excited that they will continue to provide He Poutama Rangatahi services. I’d be surprised if that member isn’t pleased that they’ll continue to do that.

Question No. 10—Local Government

10. Local Government

RYAN HAMILTON

National Party · Hamilton East

to the Minister of Local Government

What recent announcements has he made on capping council rates?

Simon Watts

National Party · North Shore

Minister of Local Government

For too long, Kiwis have seen unsustainable double-digit rate rises at a time when they can least afford it. Last week, we said enough is enough and announced that we will cap increases to council rates, at a time when central government, businesses, and households are tightening their belts. Councils need to do the same.

Ryan Hamilton

How will the proposed rates cap work?

Simon Watts

National Party · North Shore

Minister of Local Government

We’ve adopted a target band approach, similar to the way the Reserve Bank approaches inflation. This will mean that rates increases can only be between 2 and 4 percent per year. These numbers are linked to the midpoint of the inflation target and long-run GDP growth. The upper band ensures that rate increases remain affordable and sustainable, while the lower band ensures councils keep up with investment.

Ryan Hamilton

Can councils exceed the target band?

Simon Watts

National Party · North Shore

Minister of Local Government

We acknowledge that unique circumstances may arise in which rates may need to exceed 4 percent, such as natural disasters. The rates target model allows councils to apply for a temporary deviation from the target band. But, let me be clear, deviation will be the exception, not the rule.

Ryan Hamilton

What comments has he seen on the Government’s proposed rates cap?

Simon Watts

National Party · North Shore

Minister of Local Government

You might imagine that this has been very much welcomed by ratepayers, who have been hit hard by rates increases. I’m also pleased to see that even some councillors and mayors welcome this announcement. Thames-Coromandel mayor Peter Revell welcomed the announcement, saying, “The move to a target range gives council a clear and workable framework.” Christchurch city councillor Sam MacDonald said, “This is a significant step forward in reining in the cost of living crisis. Our council is up for the challenge, and we have already got a programme in place and under way.” A rates cap is a pragmatic policy, and I encourage the whole House to get behind it.

Question No. 11—Prime Minister

11. Prime Minister

Marama Davidson

Green Party · List MP

Co-Leader

to the Prime Minister

E tautoko ana ia i ngā kōrero me ngā mahi katoa a tōna Kāwanatanga?

[Does he stand by all of his Government’s statements and actions?]

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Yes.

Marama Davidson

Green Party · List MP

Will it be communities and the environment who benefit from his Government’s pushing through of the Fast-track Approvals Amendment Bill or will this solely benefit the corporations seeking to undermine communities and the environment to rush through their projects?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

In answer to the first leg of the question, both.

Marama Davidson

Green Party · List MP

Why is his Government further expanding unchecked ministerial power over large-scale projects when the original fast-track bill was criticised widely for concentrating power in the hands of Ministers without meaningful public or environmental oversight?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

I disagree completely. We’re very proud of the fast-track legislation and the implications that it’s now having. There’ll be probably about nine projects that’ll be approved before Christmas. I just take the example of the Auckland ports, who needed to build two wharves. It would have taken five years under the old Resource Management Act, but thanks to the work of Minister Bishop and Minister Jones implementing fast track, it was done in 55 days, and on the 56th day, they started digging.

Marama Davidson

Green Party · List MP

What is his response, then, to the Parliamentary Commissioner for the Environment, who said that the fast-track bill is a “thinly veiled attempt to guarantee a favourable decision; executive overreach for which no case has been made” and that there are “no guardrails.”?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

I disagree completely. What is exciting about fast track is that we are going to get things done and built in this country. We have been tied up in red tape, green tape, just a bunch of bureaucrats, and we need to unblock the joint and get the show on the road and get it moving.

Marama Davidson

Green Party · List MP

What does he think it says, then, about his Government when the most controversial amendments in the Fast-track Approvals Act were only supported by corporations who are current and past applicants, with the other 95 percent of submitters opposing?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Well, it’s actually New Zealanders that are winning because of fast track and because of our Resource Management Act reforms, because it means that they’ll get renewable energy faster. It means they’ll get homes faster. Farmers will be able to get on with farming and growing. We’ll be able to get hospitals, schools, and roads built much quicker. That’s great stuff.

Marama Davidson

Green Party · List MP

Is the Prime Minister simply of the opinion that the Government knows best and that communities, the environment, and hapū and iwi all deserve less of a say on fast-track projects than the corporates submitting applications?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

No, I listen to the voice of everyday New Zealanders who say, “It’s just too hard to get things done and built in this country.” They can’t understand why it costs 50 percent more to build a three-bedroom house here in New Zealand than it does in Australia—because of our Resource Management Act, because of our slow track, because we’ve clogged the joint up with red tape and green tape. We’re getting rid of it. We’re prioritising economic growth and we’re going to grow.

Tama Potaka

National Party · Hamilton West

Can the Prime Minister please confirm that there are at least two Māori-led fast-track projects that have been approved, one at the top of the South called Maitahi and one at West Auckland called Rangitoopuni?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Yes, I can, and I can also confirm that iwi businesses and organisations are beneficiaries of fast track and our new Resource Management Act reforms, as well. All Treaty settlements will be upheld, but they will also be able to use their land as they see fit, exercise their property rights, and get things done and built.

Question No. 12—Media and Communications

12. Media and Communications

Reuben Davidson

Labour Party · Christchurch East

to the Minister for Media and Communications

Does he stand by his commitment on 2 July 2024 that “The Government is taking immediate action to support New Zealand’s media and content production sectors”; if so, what immediate action has the Government taken to date?

Paul Goldsmith

National Party · List MP

Minister for Media and Communications

I thank the member for the question. Yes, I stand by that statement, and the immediate focus back then was the Fair Digital News Bargaining Bill. Of course, as is highly obvious to everybody, circumstances changed somewhat at the end of 2024 with the US presidency changes, and a more cautious approach was adopted. But since then, we’ve made excellent progress on a whole host of other areas, such as finally passing legislation to remove outdated advertising restrictions on Sundays—and I do want to thank the member of their party for their bipartisan support for that, notwithstanding some snide comments made during the debate. We also made changes to the screen production rebate to help Shortland Street continue on its way, and in a period of intense fiscal challenges, we continued our funding for NZ on Air and the screen rebates alongside Minister Willis. There is much more that I could go into.

Reuben Davidson

Labour Party · Christchurch East

Supplementary—[Interruption]

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Wait for your colleagues—I mean the whole House—to give you silence while you’re asking a question.

Reuben Davidson

Labour Party · Christchurch East

Does he stand by his statement that “Firstly, the Government will progress the Fair Digital News Bargaining Bill with amendments, to support our local media companies to earn revenue for the news they produce.”, and, if so, given that other countries have taken steps in that direction, why has the legislation still not had its second reading more than a year later?

Paul Goldsmith

National Party · List MP

Minister for Media and Communications

It’s important for politicians to be light on their feet. That member, of course, did hear the answer to that question in the previous answer, and I’ve given them the answer, and I think it makes perfect sense. I’d encourage him to try and be a bit more light-footed next time.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

No, hang on. Wait on. That’s not an acceptable thing. You can’t determine what he knows. If he wants to ask the same question over and over, he can. You should answer it over and over as well. Reuben Davidson, ask the question again.

Reuben Davidson

Labour Party · Christchurch East

The same question again?

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Yeah.

Reuben Davidson

Labour Party · Christchurch East

Thank you, Mr Speaker—

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Well, if you can’t remember it, just move on.

Reuben Davidson

Labour Party · Christchurch East

Luckily, I have it written down. Thank you, Mr Speaker. Does he still stand by his statement that—and I repeat—“Firstly, the Government will progress the Fair Digital News Bargaining Bill with amendments, to support our local media companies to earn revenue for the news they produce.”, and, if so, given other countries have taken steps since, why has the legislation still not had a second reading more than a year later?

Paul Goldsmith

National Party · List MP

Minister for Media and Communications

As I said in my answer to the primary question, that events have changed since I made those statements, and to paraphrase John Maynard Keynes, when the circumstances change, I change, and what else would he do?

Reuben Davidson

Labour Party · Christchurch East

How many New Zealand jobs could be protected if the Government did what they promised to do more than a year ago and passed Acts like the Fair Digital News Bargaining Bill?

Paul Goldsmith

National Party · List MP

Minister for Media and Communications

Well, it’s impossible to calculate.

Reuben Davidson

Labour Party · Christchurch East

Does he share the concerns of his National Party colleague Greg Fleming regarding the impact of a 25 percent reduction in funding to multimedia, and, if so, has he raised these concerns with the Minister for Māori Development?

Paul Goldsmith

National Party · List MP

Minister for Media and Communications

We all know that Mr Fleming has a wide range of concerns and he passes them on to us regularly and we are very supportive of those concerns. What I would say, of course, is that the most important thing we can do for the media is to get the economy growing again so that advertising revenue grows, and that is what our Government is absolutely committed to do. I would also make the point that there’s been a lot of work that’s been done in this area, and I encourage Labour to continue on in the spirit of bipartisanship, which they showed on the Sundays and public holidays. There’s much more that we can do together.

Reuben Davidson

Labour Party · Christchurch East

How can the media and content production sector have any confidence in him when his party didn’t even turn up to vote on the only legislation he has introduced to support the sector since he became the Minister, and now even his own MPs are second-guessing his Government’s cuts?

Paul Goldsmith

National Party · List MP

Minister for Media and Communications

I’m not quite sure what the circumstances are that the member is referring to, other than to say that notwithstanding all the fiscal pressures, we continue to fund NZ on Air, we continue to fund the screen rebates, and we’ve also put some extra resources into the local democracy and the open justice initiative, which have been great initiatives and I’m sure will be welcomed right across the sector. I’d leave it at that—oh, by the way, no, I won’t leave it at that. One thing that we haven’t done is waste $20 million on a failed RNZ and TVNZ merger—[Interruption]

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

That’s enough—no, that’s enough. Thank you. That concludes oral questions. We’ll take 30 seconds for those who have other items of business to go to to leave the House quietly, without conversations on the way.

Bills

Infrastructure Funding and Financing Amendment Bill

First Reading

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister for Infrastructure

I present a legislative statement on the Infrastructure Funding and Financing Amendment Bill.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

That legislative statement is published under the authority of the House and can be found on the Parliament website.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

I move, That the Infrastructure Funding and Financing Amendment Bill be now read a first time. I nominate the Finance and Expenditure Committee to consider the bill.

Over the last three decades, house prices in New Zealand have increased more than any other OECD country. According to the OECD’s Better Life Index, we ranked 40th, out of 41 countries, for housing availability—just in front of the Slovak Republic. Our housing crisis has held us back economically and socially. As I’ve said many times, the Government is determined to get on top of this problem by focusing on the fundamentals, treating housing as a complex and dynamic system. There are three pillars to our housing growth programme: pillar one is about freeing up land for development and removing planning barriers; pillar two is about improving infrastructure funding and financing to support growth; pillar three is about incentives to support growth.

Pillar one includes housing growth targets, requiring them to enable 30 years of development capacity, enabling intensification and a greater mix of uses in the right places, and making greenfield growth easier.

Members who have read—or at least glanced, so far, at—the Planning Bill that is being introduced to Parliament today, which will have its first reading next week, will notice that one of the aims, or goals, of the new system is competitive urban land markets. That is an extremely important objective and goal for the system, and that is reflected in the bill we are reading for a first time today, as well.

Pillar two of the Government’s reforms relates to infrastructure funding and financing. This is very important, because you can have as much land supply and abundant development opportunities as you like—whether or not that’s achieved through housing growth targets or more responsive land supply and land release mechanisms in cities, which we’re also proposing—but without the infrastructure and without the nimble infrastructure funding tools, the capacity will not be realised into, ultimately, houses.

Pillar two is under way as well. We’re publicly consulting on an exposure draft of the Local Government Infrastructure Funding Amendment Bill; this is to replace development contributions with a development levy system. Public consultation runs until February next year. The Government intends to introduce legislation mid - next year. The reality is that under the status quo, councils and developers face significant challenges to fund and finance enabling infrastructure for housing. The Government’s aim is to move to a future state where funding and financing tools enable a responsive supply of infrastructure where it’s commercially viable to build new houses. The aim is to shift market expectations of future scarcity, bring down the cost of land for new housing, and improve incentives to development land sooner rather than land banking.

It brings us to the Infrastructure Funding and Financing (IFF) Act, which was established in 2020 by the previous Government, picking up on work developed by the John Key and Bill English - led Government in 2016 and 2017. It’s an alternative means to fund and finance infrastructure for urban growth. It involves the establishment of a special purpose vehicle to finance the infrastructure needed to enable development, repaid by levying the properties which benefit off council balance sheets.

I think it would be fair to say that the Act has fallen short of delivering infrastructure needed to respond to growth. Only two IFF Act levies have been established since 2020. This was a piece of legislation developed in a relatively bipartisan fashion, actually. As I say, it started life in the last National Government, passed by the Hon Phil Twyford and friends in 2020. It has not quite worked out the way that people intended it to work out. This amendment legislation makes some, I think, sensible amendments to allow it to be used more frequently in a cheaper way and in a way with less red tape. The bill aims to remove unnecessary barriers to using the Act and to improve the viability of it to make the levy development and approval process simpler and more streamlined.

The improvements to infrastructure funding and financing reflect the Government’s overarching approach of growth paying for growth to enable more flexible provision of infrastructure that responds to development. As I said earlier, what we’re trying to do is move to a system where there are abundant development opportunities and the funding and finance required to support those development opportunities is allowed to turn up and is not artificially constrained by artificial constraints on funding and financing, in the same way that there are artificial constraints on land supply, which is what we have at the moment. Our future state will move to a world in which the economics of development dictate where and how it happens and when it happens, rather than artificial planning rules which have held our cities back for too long and are the root cause of the housing crisis that has bedevilled New Zealand for too long—with all of the moral, fiscal, social implications that come from that. Fixing our housing crisis is going to take a long time. It is not something that can be done overnight. It is a complex system, but we are making good progress, picking up on some of the good work done under the previous Government.

In terms of streamlining the levy approvals process, the extensive process required for applicants to have a IFF levy approved can be a barrier when trying to use the Act. We are now simplifying requirements for levy proposals and recommendation reports, simplifying the mandatory considerations the Minister of Housing must take into account when assessing a levy, improving certainty for developer-led proposals by limiting councils’ ability to withhold the necessary endorsements where statutory requirements have been met, and removing the requirement to assess a levy’s affordability for these proposals supported by developers and all other existing landowners. For new developments, levy payers self-assess affordability and opt in to the levy when deciding to purchase a property. As such, ministerial consideration of whether a levy is affordable is not needed if existing landowners are supportive. These things will make a difference, and I’m looking forward to seeing the feedback through the select committee to see whether or not we’ve got it exactly right. This bill will go to a select committee, and I’ve nominated the Finance and Expenditure Committee, because I think that’s the appropriate committee for it.

The bill broadens the scope of the Act to improve its flexibility and viability for a range of infrastructure projects. This is really important. This will better reflect developer-led use of the tool and enable the Act to be used for transport projects delivered by the New Zealand Transport Agency (NZTA) or KiwiRail as part of a funding stack for transport infrastructure investment, where it benefits property owners. Broadening the scope of the Act beyond simply addressing local authority funding and financing constraints aligns with wider transport system changes that signal to the Government Policy Statement on Land Transport to require NZTA to consider alternative funding and financing arrangements for all new infrastructure projects, to ensure that New Zealand delivers more infrastructure sooner. The simple proposition is this: if there is public expenditure on infrastructure projects that private landowners benefit from, and they are the beneficiaries of that expenditure, they should help to cover the cost of that expenditure. It’s a form of value capture—some would call it that; we prefer the term “cost recovery”. It doesn’t actually matter what you call it. The proposition, or at least the value proposition, is a simple one. There’s a lot of complexity to actually implementing it, but the changes we’re making through the IFF Act amendment will allow that to happen.

It will also enable the Act to be used for water infrastructure investments delivered by new water organisations delivered through the Local Water Done Well policy. The bill replaces the definition of “community infrastructure” so that it’s not required to be owned or controlled by territorial authority. This broadens the potential use of the Act to include community infrastructure that is owned or controlled by a third party rather than vested in a territorial authority. The bill will enable levy deferrals to help manage any affordability concerns and better support the use of the Act for the purposes of value capture or cost recovery. There’s a variety of other changes to improve the Act, including clarifying the special purpose vehicle may commence recovery action if levies remain unpaid for more than four months, and amending the Local Government Rating Act to ensure that rates and levies rank equally in the event of a rating sale.

This is an important series of changes, but it can’t be divorced from the context of the flexible funding system we’re trying to create for local infrastructure. This is one tool in the toolkit. It will be used, I think, for large, new greenfield subdivisions on city fringes where the economics of that development make sense. I’ve already had some people say to me, “Well, I’ve had a look at the IFF. It doesn’t work. It’s too expensive.” Well, that’s OK. That’s actually OK, because if the cost of the infrastructure and the special purpose vehicle doesn’t make it economic to develop, then maybe we shouldn’t be developing it. Actually, letting price signals diffuse themselves into land markets is actually part of the problem. Too often, we’ve been cross-subsidising development in areas that don’t make sense and not allowing those price signals to work effectively. We may see it for greenfield subdivisions where people can make a buck out of it and the economics stack up. We will also, potentially, use it for large, new State highway projects in the future. Also, just in my last 25 seconds, the next time we do a City Rail Link project and we build a brand new $6 billion train station next to a casino, we should ask them to help cover the cost of the massive new infrastructure we’ve put into their private company. We’ll be able to do this with the changes.

Chlöe Swarbrick

Green Party · Auckland Central

Let’s go for a wealth tax, Bish!

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

You don’t need a wealth tax; you just need sensible infrastructure funding tools. I look forward to your support.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

The question is that the motion be agreed to.

Kieran McAnulty

Labour Party · List MP

Thank you, Mr Speaker. We’ve heard from the infrastructure and the local government sector the very clear message that they want some certainty. They want to see an end to the stop-start carry-on that they have seen over the last couple of years, and today is a particularly important day to point that out, because it is relevant to this bill.

We’re hearing a lot today around how much the Government’s proposed changes to the Resource Management Act will make things better, but no mention of the fact that it was this Government that put us back to the old Resource Management Act, which was no longer fit for purpose. Now, I’m pleased that the Government is not following the approach where there was a reform, they scrapped the reform and went back to the old approach and then used that as justification for the fast track, and then bypassed proper parliamentary procedure and public feedback to pass that bill.

At least they haven’t scrapped the original Infrastructure Funding and Finance Act and started again. That is a positive, and it gives an opportunity, as the Labour Party, to be able to indicate that we will support this bill to select committee, because it does build on what was intended by the 2020 Act. It is true that only two levies have gone through the process as a result of that, and it is quite clear that there are some barriers to establishing those.

We would like to see more occur, because at the end of the day, many councils are at their debt ceiling. Even with the changing of that ceiling by this Government, they will be under significant financial strain. That is particularly true with this bungled water reform by this Government, the additional requirements that they have placed on councils, and the Government’s inability or unwillingness to consider alternative revenue streams for councils outside rates—and let’s not fall into the trap of thinking that a rates cap is going to be the silver bullet here. In many cases, it is going to make things more difficult, and, in fact, this is potentially the only way in which some areas will be able to go through some infrastructure projects, because, frankly, councils’ hands will be tied behind their backs. But what is of concern is the lack of consultation that was delivered as part of the development of this bill.

Now, it’s been a couple of years, and, frankly, the changes that are in this bill have been signalled by Ministers for some time, and so it is quite telling that if you look through the departmental reports and regulatory impact statements, it’s quite clear that departments did not have enough time—they say so themselves—to assess this and actually understand whether the changes that are being proposed here will actually deliver what the Minister has just outlined. It’s very difficult for us, as a Parliament, to assess a piece of legislation when departments haven’t been given enough time to actually look at what is being proposed and give Parliament a steer as to whether it’s going to work.

It’s quite telling that they consulted with only a hand-picked, select few councils, and not councils across the board and not Local Government New Zealand. They could argue that they only talked to those councils that are at their debt ceiling already, but, as we know, many, many more are predicted to fall into that situation, and they will indeed be interested in the provisions that are proposed in this bill.

It is also interesting and worth noting that the Government hasn’t consulted with iwi on this bill, despite the fact—even though the Minister’s speech didn’t touch on this—that this bill actually proposes quite significant changes to how Māori land is viewed and considered as part of this process. Now, I am pleased that it is going to select committee, because we will work constructively with the Government to look to improve this bill, but we will have questions around that.

The expansion of this to include transport is worthy of pretty detailed assessment. We want some assurances that the changes that are being proposed around Māori land in particular do not disadvantage those shareholders in that land. Given their unique status, which is unlike any other shareholders of landholdings in this country, and of course the responsibilities of the Crown through Te Tiriti o Waitangi, it is essential that we get those reassurances, and I’m not sure that enough consideration has been given to changing the requirement for a levy to be linked to a specific project. We’re keen to dive into those at select committee, and so we’re happy to support it to there, but we’re keen to look into it more.

Julie Anne Genter

Green Party · Rongotai

Tēnā koe, Mr Speaker. Tēnā koutou e te Whare. The Minister for Infrastructure, in his speech, referred to enabling more greenfield development, and I think I have to fundamentally disagree with his assertion that that is necessary or desirable for Aotearoa New Zealand. We have known now for decades—there has been study after study that has quantified—that infrastructure costs associated with greenfields development are significantly higher. The places we need homes and businesses and schools—and everything else, now—is within the existing urban area, close to good quality public transport in walkable neighbourhoods.

Simon Court

ACT Party · List MP

That’s another “can’t”.

Julie Anne Genter

Green Party · Rongotai

That is what will deliver for Aotearoa New Zealand.

Simon Court

ACT Party · List MP

We say “can”.

Julie Anne Genter

Green Party · Rongotai

The people opposite are actually just a bunch of walking contradictions, Mr Speaker, if I could. Like, everything they say as a Government is a walking contradiction, because they say that they want things to be value for money and they want taxes to be low, and at the same time, they have a wish-list of outrageously expensive highway projects which are not actually going to improve productivity at all but would probably facilitate a lot of suburban sprawl.

The one kind of coherent thread that links what the Government is doing is that they’re doing what land bankers want. It’s those people who own farmland that is somewhere out near Auckland who are going to benefit from the Government investing in highways, because they’ll be able to sell off that land as houses. Will New Zealanders benefit from that? Well, no. Those neighbourhoods will be neighbourhoods where people do not have good, affordable access to the amenities that they need to live good lives. Overall, our country will be spending more on fuel and private vehicles, we’ll have higher emissions, more air pollution, more sedentary lifestyles. All of that is cost, cost, cost, cost, cost. It actually doesn’t make people happy, and it doesn’t benefit the economy, but it does benefit some vested interests. That’s why you can guarantee that the coalition Government will be doing something—to help those vested interests make more and more money at the expense of public good and our taiao, our environment, and our climate.

When it comes to infrastructure funding and financing, like, the whole thing is a very complex, new structure that tries to get around the fact that if we want to have more infrastructure, we have to pay for it. As much as they say, “Well, we’ll internalise the cost of that infrastructure.”, when does that ever happen? It’s not happening. If it did—if people actually had to pay the cost of the infrastructure—it would be hugely unaffordable, and they would choose not to develop there; they would choose not to live in those places. That’s the truth; it’s quite, quite simple.

Now, we’re going to support this bill to select committee—and we did support when the previous Government did it—but, ultimately, what they’re trying to get at is the idea that public infrastructure needs to be paid for by a group of people who benefit from it, which is actually the public, and that’s what taxation is meant to do. If you are using more direct pricing mechanisms—if we were doing that, we certainly wouldn’t be prioritising the highways they’re prioritising, we wouldn’t be prioritising greenfield growth, because we have quantified the cost and it is unaffordable.

What we need Government to be focusing on is removing the barriers to building density done well in our existing urban areas; investing in high-quality, fast, frequent, affordable, free public transport in rail and electric bus services linking up our communities across the motu, as we once had. That would all make sense. When you go to other countries—and I appreciate that many people here won’t know what the rest of the world is doing, but if you go to other countries that we aspire to be like, they have much higher use of and much higher investment in public transport, in walkable and cyclable neighbourhoods. They do have more community-driven development of mixed-use neighbourhoods, which here, in New Zealand, it’s like, “Let the landowner dictate how the city develops.”, which is crazy. It just doesn’t deliver what people need to live good lives. People need to be walking distance from schools, walking distance from public transport stops.

The big lie is they claim that this is all about choice—[Interruption]

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

That’s enough.

Julie Anne Genter

Green Party · Rongotai

—rubbish. Rubbish. It is not about choice.

Simon Court

ACT Party · List MP

Mr Speaker, point of order. I don’t mean to interrupt the member, because she is quite economically coherent on most matters, but she’s just referred to members of the governing parties as liars. I object to that. It’s unparliamentary. It’s going to bring the House into disorder.

Julie Anne Genter

Green Party · Rongotai

Speaking to the point of order, Mr Speaker, I appreciate that members might be feeling sensitive, but I’d said, “The big lie”—not accusing someone of being a liar at all. “The big lie” is a more general thing about the idea that cars give independence and freedom.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Yeah, well—

Julie Anne Genter

Green Party · Rongotai

It’s an expression.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

I think it’s a debating point. You’ve got 22 seconds left.

Julie Anne Genter

Green Party · Rongotai

People have not chosen this. This is something that benefits an overseas industry that sells motor vehicles and fossil fuels to us at high, high cost; that actually drains our country’s productivity, makes our air dirtier, our water dirtier. It’s the source of all the microplastics in the oceans, and it costs us a whole lot of money. The Greens have a better solution.

Simon Court

ACT Party · List MP

Thank you, Mr Speaker. Today’s first reading of the Infrastructure Funding and Financing Amendment Bill is about fixing one of the biggest handbrakes on New Zealand’s growth: how hard it is to get infrastructure built when and where communities need it. The original Act came out of a rare moment of genuine innovation. A developer found a practical way to deliver the infrastructure for the Milldale development without being trapped by council debt limits or funding constraints. It should have set the standard for how we fund future growth. Instead, the Act has barely been used. It’s been weighed down by process, bureaucracy, too many chances for delay or obstruction by those who don’t carry the cost of saying no. This bill removes those barriers so that more projects can get off the ground. It expands so you can use the Act. It improves viability of a wider range of infrastructure and it simplifies the levy and an approval process so the tool becomes practical instead of theoretical.

The bill widens access to the Act, extending it to new water organisations like Local Water Done Well and to transport projects covered by the New Zealand Transport Agency and KiwiRail. New Zealand has a massive backlog of infrastructure needed to support growth. If the people who benefit can pay through a levy, these projects can move sooner rather than waiting for councils’ balance sheets to catch up.

The bill also makes sure that developer-led proposals get a fair run. When developers meet statutory requirements, councils will be required to endorse them instead of finding new ways to stall those projects. That certainty has been missing for far too long.

We also introduced levy deferrals, giving flexibility where affordability concerns arise, and better supporting use of the Act for cost recovery purposes. The current levy process is so complex it puts people off before they begin. This bill fixes that by enabling levy orders to be made directly on the terms of the levy proposal itself, removing duplication and simplifying the process for developing a recommendation report; simplifying mandatory considerations of the Minister of Housing, cutting paperwork in the evidence burden placed on applicants; removing the ministerial affordability assessment, where developers and all existing landowners agree to the proposal; removing the need for an infrastructure endorsement, where the infrastructure will not vest in a responsible authority, making the Act far more workable for developer-led and owned assets. These remove real-world costs, time delays, and the friction that currently kills the momentum that will actually get more homes delivered sooner.

The bill also provides several targeted fixes to the Act to make it usable on the ground. These include providing special purpose vehicles clear authority to begin recovery action if levies remain unpaid for more than four months; allowing infrastructure to be completed for up to two years before a levy proposal is submitted, because sometimes developers work much faster than the system they’re forced to work within; ensuring councils can recover reasonable administrative costs when providing endorsements on these proposals; refining the definition of “protected Māori land” so that relevant land can be identified from publicly available information rather than forcing proposers to spend potentially months and a whole lot of money to identify records that are almost impossible to find.

The new changes will prevent double-dipping by ensuring levies and development contributions cannot fund the same infrastructure more than once, expanding how leviable land categories may be defined, including developed or undeveloped status, floor area, or categorising land at a fixed point in time. Together with minor and technical improvements, these changes finally make the Infrastructure Funding and Financing Act a practical tool. They give developers, councils, and central government clearer rules, better incentives, and far fewer avenues for delay. Combined with the Government’s Going for Housing Growth programme, this bill helps build a system that actually supports flexible, demand-led growth instead of resisting it at every turn.

This bill cuts through obstacles and enables people who want to build to actually get on with building. That’s how we fix what matters for New Zealanders—more homes, more infrastructure where we need it, delivered without the bureaucratic drag that has kept this country back. I commend this bill to the House.

Andy Foster

NZ First Party · List MP

Thank you, Mr Speaker. This is one of many initiatives being made by this Government to make it easier, cheaper, faster, and more certain to get things built and delivered in New Zealand. We have to raise our productivity—that is what, ultimately, this is all about. If we’re going to have a higher quality of living—a higher standard of living—and if we’re going to be able to deliver the public services that we want to deliver, we have to raise our productivity. It doesn’t grow on trees. We can’t borrow that living standard. We can’t borrow those services, as some in the Opposition benches seem to want us to do.

New Zealanders have been trying to deliver that higher productivity with a ball and chain wrapped around our collective ankles. This bill is part of reducing that barrier. Today, we’ll be talking about making consenting easier. We’re also talking here about making the financing and funding and delivering of infrastructure easier and cheaper. Industry and business know this; this Government knows this; I’m not quite sure if all of the Opposition know it. They keep on complaining about workers, particularly in the construction industry, leaving for Australia, and one of the things they don’t seem to realise is that every time we, in this Government, remove a barrier that helps more construction happen, that is helping to keep those people here in New Zealand.

It was a real delight to be on the West Coast recently to visit a number of mines and to see that there were a number of the people working in those mines who have come from Australia to work in New Zealand because we are providing employment opportunities in New Zealand—in this case, on the West Coast, which I know is a place very familiar to you, Mr Speaker. This bill is about helping to provide funding through making the Infrastructure Funding and Financing Act (IFF) easier and less bureaucratic, as we’ve already heard. At the moment, it’s only being used in two places in New Zealand, and that obviously shows the barrier that is there.

Two final things to say: the first is a note of caution. The bill’s general policy statement says that the IFF Act was introduced to help deliver infrastructure projects free from local authority funding and financing constraints. Well, I note that we’re also, as a Government, trying to make sure that we keep a lid on rates rises. What we don’t want to do is to see IFF being used as a way around rates rises and the limitations that there are on council raising money because there is a limitation on how much money they can take from their ratepayers, which we want to make sure there is a limitation on.

The second one is that as the Minister introduced this, he talked about growth paying for growth, and that’s a really, really, important concept. When we had the Infrastructure Commission in front of the Transport and Infrastructure Committee during scrutiny week, they told us, in answer to questions, that growth, at the moment, is paying for something between 30 and 50 percent of the costs of growth. That means growth is nowhere near paying for growth, and that means that the costs of that growth, at the moment, are landing on existing ratepayers, consumers, and taxpayers, and that’s something that needs to change.

I was surprised by the comments made by Julie Anne Genter in this debate, talking about greenfield development, and then, somehow, it’s a bad thing that that happens, and somehow linking it with the transport agency and KiwiRail. What this specifically does is it allows the possibility that the likes of the NZ Transport Agency and the likes of KiwiRail can say, “Look, we have built some infrastructure that allows some development to happen, and we are going to charge the beneficiaries of that development for some of that cost.” That is growth paying for growth. That’s been a hole in the system for a very, very long time. It’s a great thing that we move to fix that, and I look forward to this bill progressing. I commend it to the House.

Catherine Wedd

National Party · Tukituki

Look, it’s time for us to get things built in this country—say yes to housing, yes to infrastructure, yes to renewable energy, and this bill is about providing the financing tools to do that. I commend it to the House.

Barbara Edmonds

Labour Party · Mana

Thank you, Mr Speaker. I rise to take a call on the first reading of the Infrastructure Funding and Financing Amendment Bill. Earlier this morning, I had the privilege and the pleasure to attend the opening of 18 new homes, which will be owned by Pacific people, in Porirua East. What was really important about that project is that it was a project that spanned different Governments. In Budget 2020, $249 million was set aside for that particular project, with a commitment to $115 million over 10 years to build up to 300 new homes in Porirua East. What also accompanied it was a $132 million investment in the Infrastructure Acceleration Fund, which cleaned up—basically fixed—the pipes in Porirua East so that we didn’t have sewage going into the Porirua harbour whenever there were heavy rains. Effectively, if we hadn’t fixed that pipe, about up to seven swimming pools of sewage could flow into the Porirua harbour.

Thankfully, through the work at the time, the Labour Government—I was the local MP—local iwi Ngāti Toa Rangatira, the Porirua City Council, and the Central Pacific Collective managed to now be in the process of actually building homes; built the homes; and, tomorrow, 18 new homeowners will actually be able to turn the key into their properties. What’s important about that is it shows an element of bipartisanship, because, yes, the funding was done in 2022; the works had started in relation to that particular project. But what was really good—and I acknowledge the Minister, Dr Shane Reti, today, who attended that particular opening. I acknowledge them for not cancelling the project. That was a really important point: to both acknowledge that they didn’t cancel it but also that it’s actually continuing. I think acknowledgments are due where they are due.

I do want to acknowledge Minister Bishop as well. In his first reading speech, he spoke about how this particular piece of work—which ended up being the Infrastructure Funding and Financing Act 2020—had started under the previous Government, was continued by the Labour Government, came into an Act, and the Minister is bringing forward improvements to this particular bill. We do welcome improvements to this particular Act to ensure that there is sufficient flexibility to be able to allow for infrastructure funding and financing. I want to acknowledge the Minister for those particular comments.

I also acknowledge our infrastructure spokesperson, the Hon Kieran McAnulty. He spoke about the number of times that we have been approached by the infrastructure sector. I was the infrastructure spokesperson before the Hon Kieran McAnulty, and I have lost count of the number of sector leaders, organisations, construction firms, and engineering firms who approached me during that period—and still to this day—about pleading for a bipartisan approach when it comes to infrastructure. Infrastructure projects don’t just get spades on the ground on day one. A lot of planning, a lot of processes, need to happen, because we would not have been able to build 300 homes had we not fixed the pipes underneath the ground. That’s just a matter of form, particularly for a city like Porirua City, which was built for 6,000 and now has close to 70,000 people who live there. It’s so important for infrastructure—for the sector—to have some certainty.

Labour is happy to support this bill through the first reading so that we can hear some submissions during the select committee phase. We, again, want to acknowledge the Minister for allowing the select committee phase to happen for such an important bill.

I do want to echo the concerns by Kieran McAnulty around the consultation for this. It’s now by the past; however, my disappointment, really, is that the regulatory impact statement was finalised in November 2024. That’s, like, a year ago—a year ago. Officials and Ministers could have kept consulting to finalise that regulatory impact statement, given that it’s taken a year to get this bill to the House, to the point—well, we’re basically hitting up a wall to Christmas. We’ve got, obviously, something big happening next year with an election. But, hopefully, through the select committee process, I do encourage the community to submit on this, and the particular sector.

My last concern, which I would just want to put on the record for officials, is just around eligible infrastructure—around community infrastructure. They’re broadening the definition of that. Looking forward to seeing their advice when it comes to the Finance and Expenditure Committee. I commend this bill to the House.

Grant McCallum

National Party · Northland

Thank you, Mr Speaker. Well, this Government is about getting things done, and it’s about getting growth to fund growth, and getting things done now. The communities, like Kerikeri, are sick and tired of paying too much for land because it’s taking too long to get things approved and it’s taking too long to get funding because councils say no. I commend this bill to the House.

Tangi Utikere

Labour Party · Palmerston North

Kia orana, Mr Speaker. I rise to take a call on the Infrastructure Funding and Financing Amendment Bill. As my colleagues have already indicated today, the Labour Party will be supporting this bill through to select committee.

It’s been already mentioned that the previous Government brought this bill into being. The focus there is on looking at alternative means to support growth in high-growth areas. Now, infrastructure is always a challenging issue for, I think, any council around the world and around the country—in New Zealand—as well.

I want to acknowledge the comments that my colleague the Hon Barbara Edmonds has just concluded, making acknowledgments where they are due—that is important. But I also think it’s important to indicate criticism where criticism is due. While this is a bill that seeks to try and speed up or free up the ability to fund some key pieces of infrastructure, we also know that in some communities—in many communities—there are pieces of infrastructure that, effectively, have been put on hold because the Government had put a bit of a stop to things. That is certainly something that we want to avoid, and that is part of, I guess, the approach in the Labour Party supporting this bill through to select committee.

The Minister himself talked about the applicability or relativity of transport projects being brought into the fold around that. There’s no doubt in my mind that there are, for the future, a number of transport projects and transport pieces of infrastructure that are proposed. We do have a little bit of a concern around the full extent to which this would apply to transport projects—what specific projects. That’s not going to hold us back from supporting this to select committee, but it does send a message to the Government that we will be interested, at select committee, in delving into the applicability of specified transport projects and what they might mean, because there is a real risk that the costs for these projects could either directly or directly be shifted on to households. As Mr McAnulty indicated, the proposed rates cap from the Government—there are still a number of questions to be answered in that particular space, but we do have some concerns around how transport projects will play a role as part of this bill moving forward.

Likewise, we have some concerns around the local accountability. Again, I guess that’s also framed in the local democracy sort of view, as well—how there will be an understanding that some of those local democracy or democratic considerations are applied for any of these pieces of infrastructure when they’re considered in situ or in place.

I want to make some concluding comments around my concern around what appears to be the very limited nature of consultation that has previously been undertaken. Really, they are in two areas that I’d like to touch on. The regulatory impact statement’s Annex A actually very helpfully identifies a full list of all of those stakeholders that were consulted. The interesting thing is, I guess, not who’s on there but who’s not on there. For example, Local Government New Zealand don’t seem to have been consulted. There is a massive role in terms of councils and the local government sector as to where this would play out. I note there are a number of councils listed there. Most of them are from larger metro sort of areas. Maybe that’s because of the high-growth capacity considerations that they might be placed with at the moment, but, none the less, it’s important to ensure that we have a bit of a wider brief.

The other two are in the transport and water reform areas. I know that developers and some other stakeholders have been identified here, but given that transportation is seen as a key avenue for which this bill would be applicable, I would have thought that outside of the developers, there was an opportunity there to engage from those in that particular sector. The other is in relation to the proposed changes for Māori land. The Minister has very kindly tabled a legislative statement that outlines some of the changes to that, at paragraph 8. It would have been really helpful, I think, in terms of the officials’ preparation of the regulatory impact statement, being able to identify the fact that Māori land owners, iwi, and others would have been consulted as part of this process.

That really does lend itself, in our view, to ensuring that through select committee, those are the types of issues that are explored deeply to ensure that some of the concerns that we’ve identified can be mitigated and perhaps allayed. For now, we do support this bill through to select committee.

RYAN HAMILTON

National Party · Hamilton East

Oh, it’s great to stand and speak to this bill, the Infrastructure Funding and Financing Amendment Bill. As we’ve heard, there have only been two that have been implemented, despite it having some bipartisan support. These are sensible amendments. They’re pragmatic, which will be more enabling. I’ve got one example in the north end of Hamilton: Te Awa Lakes. They’re literally on the bleeding edge of this stuff, and once they get this over the line, then they can unlock 2,500 homes. By virtue of their development, they can then unlock 25,000 homes, so I commend it to the House.

Motion agreed to.

Bill read a first time.

Greg O'Connor

Assistant Speaker

The question is, That the Infrastructure Funding and Financing Amendment Bill be considered by the Finance and Expenditure Committee.

Bill referred to the Finance and Expenditure Committee.

Urgency

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Leader of the House

I move, That urgency be accorded to:

the introduction and passing through all stages of the Resource Management (Duration of Consents) Amendment Bill;

the first reading and referral to a select committee of the Emergency Management Bill (No 2) and the Arms Bill;

the remaining stages of the Fast-track Approvals Amendment Bill and the Animal Welfare (Regulations for Management of Pigs) Amendment Bill;

the first reading and referral to a select committee of the Crimes Amendment Bill and the Public Works Amendment Bill;

the second reading and committee stage of the Electoral Amendment Bill;

the passing through all stages of the Climate Change Response (2050 Target and Other Matters) Amendment Bill;

the remaining stages of the Overseas Investment (National Interest Test and Other Matters) Amendment Bill;

the recommittal and reconsideration in the committee of the whole House of the Judicature (Timeliness) Legislation Amendment Bill to consider Amendment Paper 472; and

the introduction of the Building (Earthquake-prone Buildings) Amendment Bill.

As I think most people know, the Government does not like moving urgency—

Chlöe Swarbrick

Green Party · Auckland Central

Ha, ha!

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Well, we don’t, but it is a necessary evil in some scenarios, and it is well justified in all of these cases.

The Resource Management (Duration of Consents) Amendment Bill is being introduced and passed today as part of the Government’s resource management changes to address resource consents that will expire before the enactment of the Government’s planning replacement regime, which will take effect, pending Environment Committee progress, mid - next year.

The Fast-track Approvals Amendment Bill is a Government priority to improve grocery sector competition and to add some finesses to the fast-track regime, which is generally working well.

There’s a range of first readings that the Government is keen to send off to select committee so they can start their considerations this side of Christmas—the Arms Bill and the Emergency Management Bill (No 2), obviously.

The Animal Welfare (Regulations for Management of Pigs) Amendment Bill is having its remaining stages passed before Christmas. There is some legally imposed time pressure on that to get that passed.

The Public Works Amendment Bill is another bill that we’d like to send to a select committee this side of Christmas.

The Electoral Amendment Bill has been well signalled, and it’s important that these changes can be put in place for the next election, which will be at some point in 2026.

The Climate Change Response (2050 Target and Other Matters) Amendment Bill is also being passed this week to allow the Minister of Climate Change more time to set an emissions target.

The Overseas Investment (National Interest Test and Other Matters) Amendment Bill has, again, been well signalled, and the Government wishes to have its remaining stages passed this week so it can take effect early next year to make sure we can reduce compliance cost while ensuring we facilitate greater foreign investment into New Zealand.

The Judicature (Timeliness) Legislation Amendment Bill—

Tangi Utikere

Labour Party · Palmerston North

What’s wrong with that one?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Well, I think Mr Utikere knows what’s wrong with that one. The bill itself is fine—I think it’s actually widely supported—but due to a snafu during the—

Tangi Utikere

Labour Party · Palmerston North

A snafu?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Well, I think that’s the polite way of putting it—

Grant McCallum

National Party · Northland

Technical term.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

It’s a technical term. There was a snafu during the late-night voting on the bill. My understanding is that there was an amendment accepted from the member who’s in the chair currently that is not in line with Government intentions, so the intention is to send the bill back to the committee of the whole House stage for Amendment Paper 472, I think, so that we can fix up that little error, and, of course, we’ll get that into law probably next week, I would say.

The Building (Earthquake-prone Buildings) Amendment Bill is an important piece of legislation—yet another first reading we’d like to get away this side of Christmas.

The reality is that the New Zealand Parliament does not sit for very long, and we need these hours in order to advance Government business. It’s not something we do lightly, and something I try to avoid as much as possible.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Just every other week?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Well, Ms Brooking, it’s a busy Government with a busy agenda, and I’d just point out to the member—I was going to say, “What goes around comes around”, but that’s too negative. All Governments use urgency, as the members well know. I see Sir Geoffrey Palmer was in the media this week saying that this Government was an abuser of urgency, which I found slightly rich from the man who put the House into urgency for roughly 20 percent of the time when he was Leader of the House before the 1987 to 1990 period, when he was Deputy Prime Minister, when that Government spent around 30 percent of its time in urgency—but, anyway, with those kind of little backhanders at Sir Geoffrey Palmer, I commend the urgency motion to the House.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That urgency be accorded.

Ayes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Noes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Motion agreed to.

Vote: Urgency

Bills

Resource Management (Duration of Consents) Amendment Bill

Introduction

Greg O'Connor

Assistant Speaker

I understand it is the intention of the Government to introduce a bill.

Clerk

Resource Management (Duration of Consents) Amendment Bill, introduction.

Greg O'Connor

Assistant Speaker

This bill is set down for first reading immediately.

First Reading

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

I present a legislative statement for the Resource Management (Duration of Consents) Amendment Bill.

Greg O'Connor

Assistant Speaker

That legislative statement is published under the authority of the House and can be found on the Parliament website.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

I move, That the Resource Management (Duration of Consents) Amendment Bill be now read a first time.

Today, the Government introduced the Planning Bill and the Natural Environment Bill. It’s a major milestone in building a modern resource management system or planning an environmental management system. Those bills are not having their first readings this week. We could have done that, but I think it’s worthwhile that those bills—they’re around 700 pages, I think, in total—sit on the Order Paper and members have a good chance to digest them. They are chunky pieces of work, and I encourage members to have a read, and, no doubt, caucuses will wish to consider their positions on those bills.

Camilla Belich

Labour Party · List MP

Grateful.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

What’s that? Are you shaking your head already?

Camilla Belich

Labour Party · List MP

No, I said we’re grateful that we get to read it.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Right. Well—

Greg O'Connor

Assistant Speaker

I think there’s a legislative statement, isn’t it?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

No, no, I’m into my speech. Those bills are going to go to select committee, as I say. But until the new system is in place, there is quite a degree of uncertainty, which I think many members will have heard about around the community, around what happens in the interim. This bill, the Resource Management (Duration of Consents) Amendment Bill, aims to provide that certainty. We do want to make sure that businesses and communities can continue to operate smoothly. At the moment, consent holders face an unnecessary burden. Many of them are required to renew resource consents under the current system, even though the new system will be in place. That will streamline processes. It’s our view that that is inefficient and unnecessary. These are temporary yet urgent changes that will avoid uncertainty, stress, and cost.

There are two key changes to the bill, and, actually, it’s a very short bill. In fact, it’s a five-clause mother. It’s a five-clause bill, so it’s a very short bill. Two key changes: first, it extends resource consents set to expire before the new system is in place, and it reinstates and extends recently expired consents where a replacement application has already been lodged. This is where people have a—their resource consents have expired. I forget the exact section of the Resource Management Act—

Andrew Hoggard

ACT Party · List MP

124.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

124—there you go. Thank you, Minister Hoggard—124, where a replacement application has already been lodged, and it just makes sure that those recently expired consents can be reinstated and extended until December 2027, ensuring they fall within the general transition provisions of the new resource management legislation, which will include longer-term arrangements for all consents and benefit from select committee scrutiny.

The bill imposes minimal costs. Consent holders do not need to take any action. If Parliament agrees to this bill, authorities will simply update the records, notify affected parties, and so the only cost is really just the process of Parliament passing the legislation, which of course I’m keen that Parliament do quickly. We are progressing it under urgency to give immediate certainty and avoid unnecessary expense during the transition. Thousands of consents expire every year, and every day that passes risks additional and unnecessary cost.

There are, I know, members of this Parliament who have been contacted by people who are quite worried about what—they’re welcoming of the new regime. They’re quite keen on resource management reform. In fact, they’re very keen on resource management reform, but that is a few months away. It’s a while—well, it’s not a while away, but it’s not tomorrow; if only that was true. But it will be sort of mid - next year, depending on progress through the Environment Committee, who I’m sure will do a good job. But there’s a bunch of people out there who are pretty worried about what happens in the interim. This bill provides that certainty and that relief for them.

It’s a practical solution to a temporary challenge, and it reflects the Government’s commitment to a smooth transition. I won’t belabour the point, but there are provisions in the Planning Bill and the Natural Environment Bill, which members, I’m sure, will want to consider in due course, that allow for quite a smooth transition as the bill is passed and into the transition phase between 2026 and 2029. But, in the interim, this provides some certainty for people, and I think it will be widely welcomed in the community. Thank you, sir.

Greg O'Connor

Assistant Speaker

The question is the motion be agreed to.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Thank you, Mr Speaker. It’s very sad that we are once again in this House on an all-stages urgency bill, with a bill that we have seen only this afternoon. There is a departmental disclosure statement that we have just picked up off the Table now, because in the Minister’s press release that came out this afternoon, the link did not work. But is it quick reading, because it just says no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Has there been a regulatory impact statement? No. Has there been a proper analysis of how many consents this will apply to? No. No, no, no, no, no—that’s all we see in this report. We’re asking why this bill needs to be in all-stages urgency and how many consents it is going to affect, because we don’t get that in this departmental disclosure statement.

We’ve just heard from the Minister responsible for RMA Reform. He has said that there’s no cost to this bill and it’s totally fine. What are the costs to the environment? That is the main and most important question that we will be traversing in the committee stage and during these speeches as we find out more about this bill. He has said that “Well, it’s very short.”, but that does not mean that it is not important, and so what are the costs to the environment?

We’ve heard that it means that consents that are due to lapse get to continue on, and surely that’s a fine thing. But the types of consents that we’re talking about here, I think—but I’m not entirely sure, because, of course, there’s been no analysis—are most likely to be consents that regional councils undertake or that they administer for discharges to water and for the taking of water, which relates to irrigation, it relates to hydro dams, and it relates to drinking water, and there are a whole lot of very important issues there. It is also for putting pollution into waterways—those are the sorts of things that you have consents for.

There are also air discharges. We know that we have problems with air quality in New Zealand. Just last week, in scrutiny week, I was asking the Ministry for the Environment what has happened with the national direction on air standards that our Government was working on over two years ago now, and this Government still hasn’t put out anything on it, when we know that air quality affects our health. These are the important issues that the types of consents that are in this bill will relate to.

The coastal marine environment is also relevant. The Minister might like to spend some more time in his second reading speech describing the types of consents that he thinks will be affected by this bill.

Land-use consents are ones that are administered by territorial authorities. You might need a landuse consent to build a house in some particular zone or area. Once you’ve obtained that consent and if you don’t let it lapse and you undertake that activity, that type of consent stays, and so it is not relevant—which is my understanding, and the Minister is very welcome to correct me—to needing to roll over the consent.

I’m also interested in the point that the Minister made about people being excited about his new regime, and he was saying that it could have been sooner. I agree with the Minister that it could have been a lot sooner, if he had reviewed the Spatial Planning Act and the Natural and Built Environment Act rather than repealing them at about this time of year in 2023. That was two years ago. That work would have had significant economic benefits to our country and would have also improved the environment, and I’m worried that the people who are interested in Mr Bishop’s new bills are there because they think that they might be able to do worse for the environment. That is why they want this bill to be in place, and I would very much like the Minister to tell me in his second reading speech that I am quite wrong about that and to go into some detail about how it is so.

Lan Pham

Green Party · List MP

Tēnā koe, Mr Speaker. I was genuinely surprised when I saw this bill, and I want to put that on the record, because Minister Bishop and Simon Court have been very—maybe “collaborative” would be too strong of a word, but they’ve involved us at some points along the way in the resource management development. I want to give them credit for that. What was really disappointing with this was not having any heads-up about it at all. That would have been a really basic thing to do, right? If this is so important and urgent to the transition, just let us at least know about it, right? Then we can actually understand it. The fact that we’ve just got this bill literally an hour or two before it goes through all stages in urgency is absolutely unacceptable and very, very disappointing. I think it’s a particularly disappointing point when we’re going into what will be such a substantive process ahead, where we’re actually trying to make this whole resource management system work, and then we have this bill.

I’m thinking way back to another urgency when the Government—again under urgency—extended all coastal marine permits to 2050. That was unbelievable, but I thought, “Hey, that’s limited to that. That’s limited.” Now we have this, which applies to virtually all consents. I agree with my colleague Rachel Brooking; I would love to hear any kind of impact assessment—any kind of consideration that has been given to the impact of this bill—on extending virtually all consents to 2031. In the Government’s press release, one of the eight released—and they’ve done a great job of just completely swamping the media and the general public so that no one knows what the hell is going on—they say that this bill will ensure a smooth and fair transition to New Zealand’s new planning and environmental management system. We heard the Minister also say it will avoid uncertainty and stress. I just need to say “What bollocks” to that, because I wonder if it is fair to the many people across Aotearoa who literally cannot drink their water because consents operating in their local area are not up to scratch.

I wonder if it’s smooth and stress-free for those communities across Aotearoa who, again, make that costly mistake of doing basic things like swimming in their local river or at their local beach and get sick, just like those six kids just last month in Canterbury who were hospitalised and the dozens of people who also suffered the effect of drinking-water contamination. This is, sadly, a reality across our country, and this Government seemingly has complete blinkers on when it comes to the very real impacts of this and the fact that blanket bills like this result in those impacts continuing. When they continue like that, they don’t get better; they get worse. This is the irresponsible nature of a bill that’s coming through like this. It is estimated that every year, between 18,000 and 100,000 New Zealanders get sick from drinking pathogen-contaminated water—every year—and up to 800,000, particularly those in our rural communities, could be exposed to unsafe levels of nitrogen in their drinking water. These are the actual implications of consents that are not up to scratch and that have adverse effects on our environment. Communities are left with the cost; they suffer the health impacts.

It’s completely unacceptable, and I would love to hear answers throughout this process, but you can bet your bottom dollar that the Green Party is absolutely against this abhorrent bill.

Simon Court

ACT Party · List MP

It was also a surprise to me that this was my call, as much as it was a surprise to Lan Pham that we actually do need a common-sense move—that’s what this bill is—to recognise that we must provide a smooth pathway for those holding existing consents under the current Resource Management Act (RMA) to transition to the new planning system based on property rights, which Minister Bishop and I announced today. This bill that we’re debating now, the Resource Management (Duration of Consents) Amendment Bill, is a simple extension of time for consents under the existing RMA to allow the new resource management reforms for the Planning Bill and the Natural Environment Bill to pass into law, which the Minister and I intend to deliver by the middle of 2026.

This Government’s already implemented a plan stop, recognising it makes little sense to continue to spend ratepayer dollars developing plans that deal with a system that is soon to be replaced. This consent rollover legislation supports that. Thousands of people have RMA consents expiring over the next year, and without this bill, these people will be stuck confronting the eye-watering process and cost to renew them in what will soon become a legacy system. Today, we’re going to relieve the burden of everyone going through that painful process. However, recognising that some individuals may still want to pursue a new application or continue with their existing application, this bill provides choice to those who wish to continue under the RMA or wait to take advantage of the wonderful, enabling transitional provisions of the new system. I want to reiterate that these changes are needed to avoid wasted time, money, and effort that’s much better spent on gearing up for the new modern planning system that will deliver growth, affordable housing, and environmental improvements.

One clear example demonstrates its importance: up and down the country, people have been confronted with the excesses of the RMA we’ve so gotten used to. It’s reached absurd heights. In September, my parliamentary and ministerial colleagues Andrew Hoggard and David Seymour went to mid-Canterbury to visit a farmer by the name of David Clark. The Clarks had an A-grade environmental record that met all of their targets and 17 years of good compliance history, yet they found themselves faced with an estimated cost of anywhere between $60,000 to $300,000 to get a consent to continue operating their A-grade farm, and council were threatening to publicly notify their application, at great cost and time, unless they complied with exorbitant information requests out of all proportion to the risk council said they were trying to manage.

It turns out the Clarks’ example is another canary in the coalmine, uncovering story after story we have of world-leading farmers in similar positions facing costs and delay that they can’t afford, which they would simply, if they faced those costs, have to pass them on to consumers and households. The Clarks represent a microcosm of farmers up and down this country facing tens of thousands of dollars to reconsent operations. In many cases, these farmers are some of the best conservationists themselves. David Seymour promised the Clarks he would come back to Wellington and ask how enforcement against these “walking zombie laws” that are the RMA could be stopped. Today, we’re delivering on that promise, fixing what matters for farmers and for so many more hanging out for this temporary relief.

Today, Minister Bishop and I have announced our plans to replace the RMA with a system based on property rights and clear environmental limits. Core elements of the new planning system are intended to apply as soon as that legislation gains Royal assent sometime after mid-2026, including a further transitional consenting framework that will immediately start to relieve some of the absurdity of the RMA. Against this backdrop, this bill is clearly a common-sense and compassionate move. It’s less than 1¼ pages. I commend this bill to the House.

Mark Patterson

NZ First · List MP

Thank you, Mr Speaker. History, I think, will judge that this is a big week for the future of the New Zealand economy—a turning point, taking the blowtorch to red and green tape. This bill is relatively simple in its execution: a sensible streamlining of our planning provisions, an interim measure while our new Resource Management Act (RMA) reforms come in, and rolling over existing resource consents. The previous speaker, Simon Court, highlighted the Clarks—and I think many of the people on this side of the House will know the Clarks or have met with the Clarks and be very familiar with their scenario—but there are farmers up and down the country that have just been exasperated—thousands and tens of thousands of dollars and years in some cases, just trying to roll over existing status quo resource consents. That’s what New Zealand First has shown with aquaculture, where we’ve been prepared to roll over those permits out to 2050. We actually think this is a pretty modest provision as we work into the overall RMA reform, but it is a sensible transition measure, so we just support it. It is a completely broken system as it stands. The bureaucratic pain needs to end. We support this bill.

Debbie Ngarewa-Packer

Te Pāti Māori · Te Tai Hauāuru

Co-Leader

I stand to give a short reply to this, because I’ve only had a short amount of time—I guess this is how it’s going to feel when communities are given no notice in a non-notification of changes, including consenting changes, that affect their iwi, their hapū, their communities that they have been protecting and fighting for forever.

The whole objective of this bill is to provide certainty, but it doesn’t. It’s meant to avoid unnecessary administrative burden and costs for consent holders during the transition to new legislation. Well, what about the communities affected by those consent holders? What is it doing to them? It isn’t providing certainty. In fact, what it’s doing is it’s reopening old pollution consents that many iwi and communities hoped were finally coming to an end, in the excuse of being transitional only. What we have here, sadly, is a Government that has decided that it will continue with the degrading of water, with the unsustainable extraction of our awa, as we see with Waikato, and it has had no respect at all for those communities that have been fighting for years and years, who live in the communities and know the strain that is happening within their very own taiao.

I think one of the words that we’ve sort of had to come to battles with is that this unjustifiably grandfathers in a number of resource consents. It will effectively lock mana whenua out of any opportunities to transparently challenge any existing consents. How is that providing certainty to anyone else but the polluter? What does it take for this Government to realise that bringing these things through urgency doesn’t provide certainty for anything other than people out there knowing that this Government has one objective, and that is to destroy the resources that have been meant to be kept for our future generations. We have seen many iwi and hapū, up to two generations, that have been fighting to make sure that some of these consents come to an end. They have opposed grandfathering. It is deeply, widely rejected by iwi, by communities, many who have experienced raupatu, because it rolls over rights of existing consent holders where they would usually have been required to reapply. Why are they being denied the community input, the iwi rights, that have been acknowledged here in Treaty settlements? Why is that now being denied? This has an impact on future generations. It is absolutely deplorable that it is being done through urgency, and many, as I said, are going to be so unfairly locked out of opportunities.

Let’s think about what those consenting entities look like. Let’s name what kind of things they do. We have some of the worst, worst quality water in Aotearoa that has ever been seen in modern communities—the worst. We have polluting dischargers that are now being told, “You’re going to roll over.” There’s no accountability. “We’re so worried about you. You’re going to roll over, because your transition is more important than the community’s transition, who deserve to be well.” We’re going to have industrial emissions rolled over—industrial emissions rolled over. We’re going to see stormwater run-off rolled over; land use, poor land use, rolled over; coastal permits rolled over; marine and cultural structure rolled over, without any accountability; and we’ve got infrastructure projects—because we know this is the Government of infrastructure—rolled over meaninglessly, despite the communities fighting for years and generations to make sure they’re accountable.

One of the things that we’ve talked about, and we saw this with—and I don’t know who this Minister is speaking to, but Waikato awa have been sitting there and talking about the protection of their awa. Auckland Council, we’ve got Fonterra, AFFCO—all their consents rolled over to extract and take out whatever they want. Till when? Till 2031. This Government has absolutely declared war on iwi and all of those communities who care about their—

Grant McCallum

National Party · Northland

What a load of rubbish.

Debbie Ngarewa-Packer

Te Pāti Māori · Te Tai Hauāuru

Then go and ask them why they are all having to take this Government to court, because you refuse to listen and honour Te Tiriti and honour their settlements. This Government is doing nothing but shamelessly declaring war on all of those who care about their taiao. Kia ora rā.

Catherine Wedd

National Party · Tukituki

Look, it’s a real shame to hear, on the other side of the House, the Opposition members saying no, no, no, because on this side of the House, we say yes, yes, yes. The new Resource Management Act reforms are going to create a culture of “yes”, where we get things built in this country—infrastructure, housing, renewable energy. Look, we’re about backing rural New Zealand, backing our farmers, going for growth, and creating jobs and opportunities. I commend this bill to the House.

Tangi Utikere

Labour Party · Palmerston North

Meitaki maata, Mr Speaker. Look, it’s interesting, we’ve just heard a contribution from a Government member saying it’s all about “no, no, no, no, no”. Perhaps I’ll, just for the benefit of the member, indicate what that relates to in a moment. But I’m not surprised that she probably actually hasn’t had time to read the departmental disclosure statement herself, because it’s only landed on the Table within the last half hour or so. I think we can forgive the member for referring in that way, because she probably hasn’t read the information herself.

For the benefit of the member, the “no, no, no, no, no, no, no” is in relation to part 2 of the departmental disclosure statement. I won’t go through all of it, but I’ll just identify some of these questions to which the answer was no. The first one was: “Are there any publicly available inquiry review or evaluation reports that have been formed or that are relevant to the policy to be given effect to by this bill?” No. A further one: “Were any regulatory impact statements provided to inform the policy decisions that led to this bill?” No.

Now, there’s a little bit of a caveat with this, and it talks about the fact that the urgency within which this legislation was prepared did not allow time for a regulatory impact statement (RIS) to be developed. Now, that might be OK in circumstances where there perhaps was not a lot of time, but these Resource Management Act reforms have been something that the Minister responsible for RMA Reform and the Government have been working on for quite some time. Why is it now, suddenly, at this last moment towards the end of the year, that the Minister has, under urgency, introduced this massive change?

Now, we all accept that there needs to be some consideration around transition provisions, but why is it that the Minister and Mr Court didn’t even foreshadow or think about the implications that the changes—that they are telling us are coming next week now—would actually lead to? It’s because of the fact that the regulatory impact—we’ve just had a bill that preceded this that had a RIS. That’s fantastic. We are starting to see a common thread here from this Government, when it comes to urgency, that a number of bills don’t have regulatory impact statements. But in this circumstance, where this has been in the pipeline for quite some time, why the Government is not prepared to actually have a RIS for this piece of legislation going through all stages is baffling. It really, really is.

When it talks about the impact analysis becoming available for any other aspects that the policy might be given effect to by this bill, there again is a no. Why? It talks about there being several thousands of consents that would have recently expired or are likely to expire in the next year or so, based on the limited data that’s available. Now, it might be around half of those consents that would be captured as being due to expire. That’s what is contained in the departmental disclosure statement. But I would have thought, and I join with the Hon Rachel Brooking, that the Minister should be able to indicate how many numbers we’re talking about here. How many consents are we actually referring to? Yes, there are thousands of consents around the country that are active or are through a reconsideration or reapplication process, but how many are we talking about here?

The Minister also says that there isn’t going to be any cost associated with this apart from Parliament’s cost, but there will be costs associated with this. The reality is that the Minister needs to be able to provide to this House an understanding of the context and what that looks like, because it is pretty important.

When we are talking about consents, they are an ability to permit a particular course of action or activity, and so that does confer a special set of rights and responsibilities on those that hold those resource consents. What this bill will do, in haste, is actually extend the applicability of those consents for quite a period of time. Now, as I’ve said, I can understand why there might be an ability to turn one’s mind to the need for strong transitional provisions. I think anyone would accept that. What they actually look like, I think, would be an important consideration. But I also think it would be helpful for transitional arrangements to actually be available to the public so that we can hear around what would work for them and what wouldn’t work for them.

The fact that this is a bill that is being rammed through Parliament, all stages under urgency, actually denies the opportunity for the Parliament and members of this House to hear from those that hold consents, those that don’t, those that administer the consenting process, those that might observe—whatever. I think there are a number of questions that the Minister has an obligation to respond to. One that’s top of mind is actually: what is the total number of consents that would be impacted by this move? We’ll continue to explore that.

Grant McCallum

National Party · Northland

Thank you, Mr Speaker. I recently attended a meeting in mid-Canterbury at the Lagmhor Westerfield Hall full of farming families who are facing an uncertain future, burdened down with cost and stress. The reason was the Resource Management Act and the consent process they were engaged in. We have a new bill that will be read next week which will help make this process a lot easier for them. This bill here actually allows them to get into that new process and remove some of that stress and uncertainty. I commend it to the House.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the Resource Management (Duration of Consents) Amendment Bill be now read a first time.

Ayes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Noes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Motion agreed to.

Bill read a first time.

Vote: Bills

Greg O'Connor

Assistant Speaker

The bill is set down for second reading immediately.

Second Reading

Andrew Hoggard

ACT Party · List MP

Minister for Biosecurity

on behalf of the Minister responsible for RMA Reform: It gives me unexpected pleasure to be able to—

Greg O'Connor

Assistant Speaker

That is not an acceptable way of actually getting the attention.

Andrew Hoggard

ACT Party · List MP

I move, That the Resource Management (Duration of Consents) Amendment Bill be now read a second time.

It gives me unexpected pleasure to be able to start the speaking for this. Look, this bill is a very urgent, time-critical measure to support businesses and communities while we transition to a new, modern resource management system. The new system will deliver a more efficient consenting process. Until then, this bill provides certainty and avoids unnecessary cost for consent holders.

The bill makes two key changes. First, it extends resource consents set to expire before the new system is in place. Second, it reinstates and extends recently expired consents where a replacement application has already been lodged. This bill extends these consents until December 2027, aligning with the transition provisions for the new resource management legislation.

We’ve heard some talk around what is the proof. I have visited many farmers up and down this country over the last year and a bit. As Simon Court mentioned, myself and David Seymour visited with the Clarks. But it wasn’t just the Clarks I’ve visited. There have been numerous farmers who are under absolute stress and pressure—sitting around people’s kitchen tables with them nearly in tears over the cost that they’re expected to somehow manage to pay. We’re talking about, in some cases, over $200,000 for lawyers, for ecologists, for planners, for all of this sort of stuff to carry on farming. These are not intensive farming operations; these are often some of our most iconic extensive farming operations. I recall one in Ashburton Lakes.

Damien O'Connor

Labour Party · List MP

Rubbish.

Andrew Hoggard

ACT Party · List MP

Well, if you got off your motorbike and actually stopped occasionally, you might talk to some of these people. Ashburton Lakes, the farms I visited there—very extensive properties. They are facing massive costs in terms of being able to re-consent their farms. They have a challenge where they’re expected to somehow reduce water that is coming out of the hills at 0.3 parts per million of nitrogen down to 1.6. As it goes through their farms, it’s going down to 0.22. These are very, very extensive operations, the stuff you see in Country Calendar. These people are in absolute despair over the cost that they are facing. How on earth can they get the money off their bank manager to pay for this when, in fact, this adds nothing to their profitability?

Also, another farmer, previous winner of the Balanced Farm Environment Awards, is going through exactly the same process—again, the costs potentially in the hundreds of thousands of dollars. This is what we’re trying to avoid. As Simon said, these are “zombie laws” and these farmers are facing having to go through this incredibly expensive process, but for what, when they won’t need to do this in the new system, most likely?

This is why it is so important to give these farmers and people all up and down this country who do stuff some certainty about—they don’t need to waste money on a process that isn’t going to be around, and they can just get on with producing stuff for this country and making us move forward. I commend this bill to the House.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Thank you, Madam Speaker. Look, I just want to pick up on a few things that that Minister said—noting, of course, that the many questions I asked in my first speech were not given any answer to in the Minister’s second reading speech. But I will comment on the “zombie laws”—that, somehow, the Resource Management Act is a zombie law, when it is a law that this Government brought back. There are many plans that many councils have been implementing for a long time that relate to these resource consents that Minister Hoggard was just talking about. Of course, that Minister—Minister Hoggard—has been very involved in changing aspects of the Resource Management Act to suit some of his constituents. Some of those changes have been made without advice, without regulatory impact statements, without some groups being able to submit on them.

This is consistent with that kind of lawmaking, and it is very poor lawmaking. But what he said—what I think is really interesting is we’re being told, “Oh, we need these transitional provisions, because the new system is going to be so different. It’s going to be so different that the farmers”—that that Minister was just talking about in terms of nitrate pollution—“are not going to have to worry any more.” He said, “most likely”. That is the quote: “most likely”. Of course, that Minister can provide no analysis on whether or not something is going to be most likely or not, and what it is that he is talking about—what are these consents—because there has been no analysis.

We see that this little “no, no, no report” from this Government was dated 23 October 2025. It seems that some of this legislation was rushed—I’d like to give the other Minister, Chris Bishop, the benefit of the doubt on that, but, given that it’s 25 October, it’s not that rushed. There was certainly time to consult with other parties. There was certainly time to do more analysis and talk about the types of consents that would apply here, but that has not happened, so we are going to have to spend some time traversing those issues when we get to the committee stage.

Going back to this, what Minister Hoggard says is “most likely”. This is the real concern, now, that I have about this piece of legislation, and I’ve had no comfort for my concern from the speeches of the Government members, whereby many of them have referred to a man called John—

Grant McCallum

National Party · Northland

David.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

David Clark, rather. I have to say I know many David Clarks, but the point here is that the farmers are most likely not going to need consents under the new regime. That is not something that we’ve heard loudly from the Ministers who have been developing their new regime, which, they’ve said, in all their press releases, is going to improve the environment. So what is it: are we improving the environment or not? That is my very simple question that I would like the Minister to address in his contributions.

Now, we also heard from Minister Chris Bishop when he was doing the all-stages urgency motion that it was outrageous that Sir Geoffrey Palmer could condemn this Government for using urgency an awful lot. I want to point out to that Minister and anyone who happens to be listening that what this Government is doing is using all-stages urgency. That is, we walk up to this Table to get the bill when the Minister starts speaking on it, we get the other documents that have not been made available on the internet, and then we have to go through reading after reading, committee stage, and then the third reading all at once. That is a very bad way to make law, whatever you think of the policy.

That is a huge problem with this bill. We do not know exactly what it will mean, because there has not been the analysis. We are not getting any clues from the other side of the House, except that they seem to think that it will “most likely” mean that people who currently need resource consents will not need them in the future as it relates to pollution of our waterways. That is the specific conversation that we’ve been listening to—

Grant McCallum

National Party · Northland

They’ll move into the new Act—you know that.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Will there be environmental bottom lines in the new legislation? We’ve been told that there are going to be environmental bottom lines. Surely, then, if there is going to be pollution to waterways, that will still need some sort of consenting—so there is not the need for this transitional provision, and this bill that is coming before we’ve even discussed the new pieces of legislation. It’s very unusual to be talking about the transition provisions for an Act that Labour repealed, that this Government brought back, and now this Government says it’s going to repeal and replace with two other pieces of legislation, but we haven’t debated those two other pieces of legislation yet. They have not even been sent to select committee; they were only made available this afternoon, but, somehow, we are talking about the transitional provisions of them already. It seems a very strange way to be doing things.

Of course, I don’t know yet about the ability of councils to review these resource consents that will be rolled over. Again, we need to know how big some of these consents are, because whilst the members on the other side talk about a “family farmer”—I think it’s what they were talking about—who is having some expense with the Resource Management Act, what about the big irrigators? What about the factories that still—some of them—discharge into rivers? What about our waste-water treatment plants that often have discharges into water bodies, as well? These are all important factors, and they do go to human health. We know that our rivers are polluted.

In the 2017 election, Labour campaigned very strongly on the ability to swim in rivers again, because, unfortunately, one of the problems with the Resource Management Act and why it hasn’t worked is that those rivers have got more polluted, and that is a great stain on our country and all of us here. The last Government tried to address that with the essential freshwater package that included regulations and national direction, both in policy statement and environmental standards relating to water quality. The regional plans were to implement this, but what happened the day before the Otago Regional Council was going to implement it is that this Government, by an amendment at committee stage, put a stop to it. Then, this Government, again, in an amendment to a different bill, put a stop to any councils getting ahead on any plans.

Then we have some muddled statements about what might happen to regional councils and the roles of mayors in them. But all of this goes back to the point that this Government does not have any aim of rivers that we can swim in. What this Government is interested in is enabling further pollution of those rivers so not only are they not swimmable but they will be unusable for many other uses. We know that this is a resource that people are interested in, because you can choose: are you going to use your water to pollute or are you going to use it to provide for mahinga kai?

Grant McCallum

National Party · Northland

Solutions are on the table—you know that.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

What is it that you’re going to do? Is it going to be used for a town drinking supply?

These are all arguments which mean that the resource consents around water, whilst they have a limit of being able to go for 35 years, many of them do not, because of all the uncertainty in everything that goes into water. We know that with a changing climate, this only gets more pertinent. I do not understand why it is that we want to roll over these issues if, as Grant McCallum was just saying on the other side, that Government does care about the quality of our water.

Lan Pham

Green Party · List MP

It was very naive, actually—very naive. I really thought that Governments of any stripe had a duty of care to the environment. I think what is most disappointing about this bill is it can be easy—and I get it, because I see this area around us, and there’s lots of papers and artificial lights—to forget about the actual outcomes on the ground and the impact that decisions like this have on those places and those people. Particularly, having had some time as a regional councillor on Environment Canterbury, I know from firsthand experience that it’s those places like that tiny remaining dry land patch of vegetation and kōwhai that’s littered with indigenous species, that no one actually might know was that important. It’s processes like consent renewals that allow council or community or the landowners that are involved to actually understand the values that they hold on their own properties or in their communities. It’s those little patches of wetland where, yes, we absolutely have issues with identifying and delineating what can be grazed or not grazed and everything like that, but it’s blanket bills like this that make them valueless. It means, on the ground, the message is that these places don’t have value and that, actually, you can do whatever you need to get rid of them for a little bit of this and a little bit of that, and it’s that constant degradation and decline that is exactly how we’ve gotten into the situation where we have such isolated remnant pockets of biodiversity instead of mountains to sea corridors and where we have water quality that is so pervasively polluted across every environment that we have. Those are the realities that this bill completely misunderstands and just doesn’t seem to have any awareness of.

I really want Kiwis to know that this bill is so clearly demonstrating what the Government’s priorities are. Really, that’s about this big drum-up and this constant war on farming and all this kind of rhetoric to avoid any form of environmental improvement, no matter how small. A lot of these improvements that would have materialised if these consents were actually going through the processes that they would have, where they were needing to be renewed, and new planning instruments, where the community has actually deliberated over months, over years, and sometimes decades to get better environmental improvements, better environmental laws, and better environmental standards and practices—they just suddenly don’t apply, and we’re going to just kick it down the road for another half decade. In the meantime, things will get worse. We will be losing more of these remnant patches of biodiversity, and our water quality will be declining, because there’s not that direction and drive to actually improve the environment, and the actual direction and drive, which would mean the very investment in innovation and improvement that we so desperately need in this country, is not there. It’s about more delay and more kicking the can down the road, and that is hugely disappointing.

I wanted also to pick up on the realities of just some of the environmental aspects which will be affected by this bill being rushed through under urgency tonight. We have a network of over a thousand groundwater monitoring sites, and we know that 12 percent of those failed to meet the New Zealand drinking water standard for nitrates on at least one occasion over the last five years. Now, what that tells us is that these issues are pervasive, and we actually need tangible solutions to address them. We also know that over 45 percent of our nation’s total river length was not suitable for swimming between 2016 and 2020. You hear these stats, and it’s like, “Oh, yeah”, but we know, every summer, that the places where we used to swim and enjoy safely—people can’t take their families there anymore, and they don’t, and it’s really, really sad. It’s exactly because of bills like this, which is how we’ve got there. I think the disappointing thing is this next phase of these resource management changes, and these two new bills, in theory, could change that. Yet, here, we’re locking in these consents again—blanket extensions out to 2027 or even, like the press release says, “Based on current expectations, this means most consents will be extended to 2031.” Where is that going to get the country? It’s going to take us backwards.

It’s really extremely disappointing, particularly as someone who has been involved in this area for a long time and has seen a whole heap of delay. I’ll tell you what, as well: there’s a lot of fantastic landowners, particularly farmers, who are doing the right thing, and I want to acknowledge them, and I want to acknowledge the councils, particularly the council staff, who know their communities and their environments like the back of their hand. They know the disappointing and hugely damaging impact that this will have. We’re talking about consents that could be coming up for renewal that haven’t had, ever, environmental standards or conditions put on them, and now we’re pushing it out another half decade. That is completely unacceptable. I think what this Government has really misread with this is that Kiwis care, especially going into summer, when we are so much more connected to our natural environment, we’re out there with our picnics, we’re camping, we’re swimming, and we’re fishing, much more than earlier in the year. I hope Kiwis understand what this Government is doing tonight and are absolutely preparing themselves to send a very clear message that this is not the country that they want for our future, because it’s exactly what the Green Party feels about this.

I think the really unjust part of this, as well, is the fact that particularly iwi and hapū are often invited in when these consent renewals come up—these aren’t necessarily just your minor consents; these are serious consents with actual implications—and they will no longer be able to feed into this reconsenting process. Just like many other things that this Government are doing, it just means less community voice and less great outcomes. When it comes to the environment, that’s just particularly disappointing. It’s taking decision-making power away from communities when they’ve spent so much time and so much money on these. The Government go on about how they hate wasteful spending and all that, and yet they’re scrapping all the things that communities have put in place. This was the outcome of it; the plans and the rules and the processes were the outcome of it. This is terrible. We don’t like it.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister for Infrastructure

Well, there’s been quite a lot of, I would say, unwarranted anger, particularly from the member Lan Pham, who just resumed her seat. The reality is that in any new system, there has to be a transition. What we’re doing is going from the Resource Management Act (RMA), which has been the law of the land since 1991, through to a new system. Clearly, that is going to be challenging. There’s no way of sugar-coating that. We have an existing regime, and there’s going to be a new regime, and the new regime will be better, but in the meantime, there’s going to be quite a process. It’s going to result in the fundamental change to plans, to national direction, to district plans, to environmental plans—we’re going to have spatial plans. There’s an enormous amount of work to do. Frankly, and I can’t believe I’m saying this, the bills we’ve just introduced are the start. It has been stressful enough getting the bills ready, but in the next three years there is an enormous amount of work to do.

In the meantime, as many of my colleagues have said, there’s a whole bunch of people out there saying, “Well, hang on, what does this all mean for me?” One thing Parliament can do in those circumstances is say, “You’re all good for the next two years”, which is what this bill does. There’s quite a lot of stuff from the other side about consents and the environment. We get all that and acknowledge concerns around that, and there’s an ability through the actual bills—the Planning Bill and the Natural Environment Bill—to have a debate about that and make sure the transition is effective and done in a smooth and sequenced way. We’re happy to have a debate about that, because it is difficult to get the exact sequence right and get the transitions right. We’re very happy to engage and have a debate about that, but in the meantime, as colleagues have said, there is a bunch of people who have applied for consent renewals and have had consents that have recently expired. Frankly, there’s a bunch of people being farted around by regional councils, who are putting them through hell.

Grant McCallum

National Party · Northland

Is that a technical term?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Well, it’s not a technical term, but it’s certainly accurate, and the Government does not wish that to happen.

It’s not a long list; it’s not a 50-year extension or out to 2030 or anything like that, as others have said. It’s a two-year consent extension for a narrow class of consents, and Rachel Brooking said before, “How many?” Well, the honest answer is that we don’t know, because, again, that’s part of the problem with the RMA: we don’t actually know, because there’s no centralised, accurate monitor or level of information around all this stuff. It’s all done at a devolved, regional level. That’s, again, part of the problem. In the new system, we’ll have a digital e-plan for the entire country and a digital back end, where everyone uses the same kinds of standards and the same technology to port into. We’re going to know far more in central government around what’s happening at a local level. Decisions will be made locally, but we’ll know far more in central government. That’s a good thing, but that’s all coming. That’s one of the reasons why we need to move to the new system. We don’t know exactly how many consents it’ll be. It’ll be, probably, a couple of thousand, roughly, I’m advised.

It’s a two-year extension, from now through to December 2027. Literally, that’s it—that’s all the bill does. Despite all the heat and noise, that’s it. It’s a two-year extension. It’s a five-clause bill. That’s all it is. It’s a temporary transitional measure as part of the Government’s resource management reforms. With that, I commend the bill to the House.

Jamie Arbuckle

NZ First Party · List MP

Thank you, Madam Speaker. I rise on behalf of New Zealand First to support the Resource Management (Duration of Consents) Amendment Bill. This is like putting the presents under the Christmas tree: we are setting up New Zealand with this new Resource Management Act (RMA) replacement legislation, but, first, we’ve got to put this in place. It’s a twoyear extension, out to 31 December 2027. It gives some certainty to people that are in the process under the old RMA that we know is broken, that this Government is going to fix up. We also know the costs to those people are overwhelming. Why go through a process when the Government is going to change the legislation, change the RMA for something better? I commend this bill to the House.

Celia Wade-Brown

Green Party · List MP

Thank you. I rise to oppose this bill, and it’s a pattern: it’s imposing things, without discussion, on local government.

I want to say a few things about e-plans and the Resource Management Act (RMA). Plenty of councils, including the Wellington City Council, already have an e-plan; this isn’t some brave new world that this Government’s bringing in. In fact, if this Government hadn’t wasted everybody’s time repealing the two bills that the last Government put in place, urban planning and environment, maybe they could have modified them, maybe we could have had some intelligent discussion with Local Government New Zealand, with Taituarā, with iwi. But, no, bang! Out of the blue—just how this Government wants to centralise decision making about resources.

One of the things that I would like to highlight in our opposition to this bill is the idea that consents would necessarily go for 35 years after the date the consent commenced. If that relates to water, some of our aquifers are changing very rapidly. Many of our awa are terribly over-allocated, and quite often that has not been allocated either on good environmental grounds or on what is the best and highest economic use. Is it going for dairying? Is it going for manufacturing? Is it going for orchards? Are they as efficient as they could be, or did they just happen to be the ones that got in first? I don’t agree with just rolling over for 35 years. I understand that there has to be some transition.

I would like to say that in the new or maybe rehashed resource management planning—that, as I say, the previous Government actually made some significant improvements to the RMA. But oh no! You couldn’t say anything that the previous Government had done was OK. You just had to throw that out and bring the changes in rather than working with the people that are most concerned. Going from—there are possibly too many plans, but going to 17 plans is going to be quite hard for local councils and local people, local iwi, local environmental groups to deal with. For example, in the Wairarapa, the reforms mean going from a perfectly good combined plan—so you’ve got three councils covering a huge geographic area, but not many people. The Wairarapa combined district plan was three councils working together. Now what’s going to happen? It’s going to be thrown out in favour of a whole-of-Wellington-region plan. That will mean that Mayors Little, Baker, Zee, and Laban will have more power over what happens in the Wairarapa than Mayors Cretney, Johnson, and Wilde. That is not fair on the Wairarapa people.

This very short notice bill, with its reinstatements and extensions, is bad lawmaking. It’s brought in under urgency—again—without offering the opportunity for people to say, “Should it be a 15 years extension? Should it be 35 years extension?” Why are you so scared of listening to what people think? Is it because the last few bills you put out have had anywhere between 80 percent against them and 95 percent against them in the submissions? I don’t think that this is going to help our resource management one little bit. The Green Party opposes this rushed legislation.

Maureen Pugh

Assistant Speaker

Before I take the call, can I just remind the member not to bring the Speaker into your debate as much as you do.

Grant McCallum

National Party · Northland

Thank you, Madam Speaker. I have a challenge for the members opposite who are wondering about the “why”—why we are doing this. I challenge them to go down and talk and meet with the farming communities and the farming families—for example, in Canterbury, who are stressed out in dealing with this expensive, elongated consenting process. They’ve got no idea where their future may lie. That is why we’re doing this. Go down and actually talk to them and see what they have to say. I commend this bill.

Damien O'Connor

Labour Party · List MP

Madam Speaker, thank you, and I’d like to follow on from that speaker as to why this is happening. This is a desperate bill under urgency, which would suggest that perhaps it’s not the smartest piece of legislation and it may not be the most well-thought-through.

The reality is that this Government—the farmer’s Government, to refer to the previous member’s speech—has mucked around for over two years, or two years thereabouts, saying they’re going to promise Resource Management Act (RMA) reforms, and they’ve taken too long, and this piece of legislation is necessary because, yes, there are consents that are up for renewal under the normal process.

There’s no regulatory impact statement, there’s no select committee scrutiny, and indeed, as I read through this piece of legislation, it seems quite confusing—quite confusing. I’m not sure that the Minister has actually clarified anything in this area. I go to the Associate Minister of Agriculture, Mark Patterson, who got up and spoke about this and said that this is going to give farmers certainty. Well, it’s not, not at all, particularly if he misleads the House by saying that Clark’s farm is not intensive. It’s one of the best, I’d suggest, cropping farms that I have ever visited; highly intensive, probably—hopefully—profitable, although the industry is going through some challenges at the moment, and one that does require a consent. Now, I’m not aware of the details or the costs, other than in the area of mid-Canterbury where that farm is located, there are a number of environmental issues. Lake Hood is toxic or goes through periods of high toxicity, and people haven’t quite worked out why that is the case. If you go further down into South Canterbury, we have the Waimate water supply, which is toxic as well, and so people are scratching their heads.

The Associate Minister also misled the House in saying that the Ashburton Lakes were not affected by any level of intensification. I’ve been up there a number of times. Some of the properties have been through 10-year review. What has happened is some of the high country has been retired and the farmers have concentrated on the lower, flatter areas, and most of them are very good farmers, but they have intensified, and these are shallow lakes that, unfortunately, are seeing high levels—

Joseph Mooney

National Party · Southland

Point of order.

Maureen Pugh

Assistant Speaker

Just give me a chance. I’m not taking the point of order.

Damien O'Connor

Labour Party · List MP

These lakes are shallow, and the nitrate levels and some of the turbidity issues and that are increasing, and the council, because the lakes belong to everyone, is forced to take a look at this.

What is most important in this whole discussion and debate is that we are honest and we face up to the challenges that we have as a country. We hear from the Ministers and from the Government and coalition partners that they have resource management reform focused on property rights. While property rights are interesting, they are not just a piece of land. In fact, they are rights that accrue to each and every New Zealander, and so when we talk about protecting property rights, the members on that side of the House have to appreciate the fact that that is also protecting the rights of New Zealanders, not just those who are lucky enough to own land. While we have, of course, committed to reform of RMA—in fact, we had a process that, arguably, will probably mirror much of what the Government’s going to table in the next couple of days, from what we see—we have to acknowledge that if the Government’s reforms are focused on property rights, it’s going to create a lot of tension, a lot of debate, and a lot of dispute. If we think that it’s going to magically remove the costs of continuing to operate in an evolving environment, then we’re kidding ourselves.

I’d suggest that the council costs might be reduced temporarily, but the cost of lawyers is going to go up as we move through a judicial process to work out whose property rights are more important, a landowner’s or their adjoining neighbour or the wider public or the property rights that accrue to environmental protection or environmental integrity.

There’s a lot to work through, and what concerns me with this particular piece of legislation is it’s hastily put together, it’s not got any regulatory impact statement, it’s not had any proper assessment. I guarantee that there’ll be provisions in this bill that will be faulty. The absence of any proper select committee process, even if it had been a short one, means that we’ll pass a faulty piece of legislation that the Government will have to hastily change during or after it brings in its major reforms.

It is the reality, thankfully, that as time progresses, so too does knowledge. Our information and our analysis of some of the impacts of what we do as humans on the environment evolves. As we learn more, we must—we hope—implement better practice, and most farmers in this country have done so over the last 150 years. We were doing a lot of things even 20 years ago that we now consider abhorrent—bobby calves, cows’ tails. We’re working through a practice on tailing for lambs, protection of waterways, protection of biodiversity. All of these things now are more important, and successive Governments have altered legislation to take on board that knowledge. If we just bury our heads in the sand like a bunch of Neanderthals and think that we know it all now and what we do today, these consents, which is what we’re referring to in this piece of legislation, are appropriate for another 35 years; let’s just roll them over and not take on board or take into account the impacts—can I say that it is important that we take on board the knowledge that we have, and the assumption that just rolling over consents and moving into another regime of property rights or where property rights are paramount, I suggest, will result in a terrible outcome down the track. I am perhaps looking ahead, making some assumptions about the changes to the Resource Management Act that we’ll see, I’m not sure, maybe next year or not. But the rollover of these consents without any possible adjustment to take on board the impacts of what we’re doing is irresponsible—is irresponsible.

Some of these consents are going through a process of renewal. There’ll be quite a bit of money spent on them already—

Grant McCallum

National Party · Northland

Wasted.

Damien O'Connor

Labour Party · List MP

Not wasted at all. Say you’re in the Waimate area, where you get water from that area, you may be stuck—say, Glenavy. I was down there quite a bit, because that was where the outbreak of Mycoplasma bovis was. We moved to protect the people who were farming in Glenavy. The reality is that actually we have seen a lot of dairy investment, and that’s great. We’ve seen some impact on water quality to the point where people sourcing their water from the Waimate water supply are being advised not to drink it.

It is essential that we move as quickly as possible to adjust consents, and if there are any consents going through the process at the moment, just to roll them over and not take on board that wisdom is irresponsible. That’s why we have concerns about the passage of this legislation and that the direction of this Government is taking won’t offer certainty to farmers, because the reality of some of this we cannot ignore—we cannot ignore.

What we would like to do, and would have done through a select committee process, is make sure that the changes here are sustainable and enduring. This bill is a short-term, desperate piece of legislation under urgency that is not being scrutinised by this Parliament in the way that it should be. If farmers are thinking this offers certainty, then they should just take some careful advice from people around them, because there’s emerging knowledge and practice that must be adjusted to move into tomorrow’s world of sustainable farming to ensure that their investments are, indeed, protected.

Maureen Pugh

Assistant Speaker

Just before I take the next call, can I give some careful advice to the member who’s just resumed his seat about claims of members deliberately misleading the House. I draw your attention to Speaker’s ruling 47/4.

Damien O'Connor

Labour Party · List MP

Point of order. Look, I appreciate the point you made. I didn’t say deliberately at all. I said it was misleading because it wasn’t actually true to facts, but I take your advice.

Catherine Wedd

National Party · Tukituki

This bill is about supporting our farmers to farm and our growers to grow. Horticulture exports and red meat exports have hit record levels in Hawke’s Bay, and this happened through reducing bureaucracy, enabling our growers to grow, and enabling our farmers to farm. We need certainty for those consents for our growers, and that is what this bill is about. I commend it to the House.

Priyanca Radhakrishnan

Labour Party · List MP

Thank you, Madam Speaker. From the heckles from members opposite, one would think that their view is that this is a transitional bill and a short-term bill and that therefore it is OK to pass it under all stages in urgency, with us not having seen the bill until it was almost meant to be debated at first reading. This is a second reading debate. We would generally be talking about what the submitters had said through a select committee process, but, of course, we’re here under urgency for all stages of this bill, and so we can’t really discuss what submitters have said.

This is a bill that isn’t going to a select committee process, not even a short one, and, as Sir Geoffrey Palmer has said quite recently, in fact, this is a pattern. This is a Government that is passing way too many bills in a way that circumvents public scrutiny. It is allowing the bills to skip multiple stages and public consultation, and I don’t really see the necessity for this level of secrecy with this bill—I mean, to the point that we didn’t even know what the bill was that we were going to be debating in the House today. The link to the departmental disclosure statement in the bill wasn’t even working until we started discussing or debating this bill in the House. This is incredibly shambolic. This is a shambolic Government—and I’ll get to that point in a minute—because they didn’t need to put in place this transitional bill in the first place.

This is bad lawmaking. It was very clear in the departmental disclosure statement, once we got hold of it, that the lack of analysis is because this is a rushed piece of legislation. Minister Bishop has said previously that the fact that the Government doesn’t know how many consents this will refer to is because of the lack of information that is available in the system, but the disclosure statement is very clear that there is no analysis on the size of the potential costs or benefits of this piece of legislation, and that’s because of the urgent time frame for preparing this legislation. It has been constrained, and broader analysis of this bill is therefore constrained, as well.

It’s just really shoddy lawmaking again from this Government, and the fact is that they had two years to actually come up with their resource management reform. The fact is that they repealed Labour’s Natural and Built Environment Act and Spatial Planning Act back in December 2023—a good two years ago—and they have spent that time up to now to come up with two separate bills of their own where, largely, the difference is their ideological emphasis on property rights. Because they’ve taken all that time to come up with this, now they have to push through this rushed piece of legislation in order to provide transition—

Member

Rushed, or too much?

Priyanca Radhakrishnan

Labour Party · List MP

—and, as they say, some sort of certainty. Yes, it’s rushed, because you wasted all that time that you’ve had in Government, and therefore now you’re going to have to rush through with this piece of legislation.

As environmental NGOs have pointed out, there are concerns. There are concerns when it comes to having blanket consent extensions, and so as much as members opposite want to say until they’re blue in the face that there is really nothing to see here, that it is just short term, that it is just transitional, and that it is just about certainty, it is not, because having blanket consent extensions could raise a number of issues. It could pose serious risks to water quality, to biodiversity, and to marine biodiversity.

What they’re really doing is locking in outdated conditions where they have the opportunity to make progressive change, but of course they have chosen not to do that. By putting in place blanket extensions, what they are doing is preventing updates that could reflect progress when it comes to new science, when it comes to the impact of climate change on biodiversity, and when it comes to changing environmental conditions.

There were options that this Government had. Instead of having blanket extensions, they could have looked at, for example, having a risk-based review. They could have looked at progressing lowrisk consents very quickly. They could have looked at accelerating even those that had significant concerns by still putting in place some sort of a review period. They could have looked at having shorter extension periods, as well. But they have chosen to do none of that. They have chosen instead to go with the blanket extensions, which will continue the war that they have been waging on the environment.

Maureen Pugh

Assistant Speaker

The member’s time has expired. Katie Nimon—welcome back to the House.

Katie Nimon

National Party · Napier

Thank you, Madam Speaker. What a day to come back to the House—it’s Resource Management Act (RMA) day. I’m thrilled to be here. It’s almost as if the Opposition is opposed to a productive economy, because that is what we are hearing from their mouths. Actually, it’s almost as if they want councils to have more work, because, ultimately, this is all about reducing the workload for councils, giving them certainty, giving landowners certainty, and consent rollovers that are giving us the necessary time and the necessary certainty to get the very important RMA and planning reform under way and across the line. That is what this is about—let us not forget. I commend this bill to the House.

Tangi Utikere

Labour Party · Palmerston North

Thank you. I didn’t expect to get to second reading on this bill so quickly, but, then again, many of us didn’t expect we’d be in urgency for this bill. I want to also acknowledge the member who’s just returned to her seat and welcome her back to the House. It was a great opportunity where she could have actually sort of elaborated a wee bit on some of the issues that she thought were being expressed in the Parliament.

Grant McCallum

National Party · Northland

Couldn’t wait to hear your contribution.

Tangi Utikere

Labour Party · Palmerston North

Sorry, what’s that?

Joseph Mooney

National Party · Southland

Two-year extension job done.

Tangi Utikere

Labour Party · Palmerston North

Oh, right. OK, well, we’ll see about that. Now, we’re still yet to hear from—the Minister talked about, yes, it’s still unknown as to how many consents we’d be talking about here. The fundamental concern, of course, is that every consent does provide an opportunity for consent holders to undertake an activity—an activity that has been assessed and an activity that has been considered with conditions to be above board. What this is seeking to do is to basically roll over a significant number of consents, regardless of any change in the operating environment, regardless of any consideration to what might be in the immediate vicinity. As we know, in any sort of environmental aspect, there will be changes, and for consents that have been in place for a number of years, on face value you might say, “Oh, well, an extra two years or three years or four years or whatever it might be is a small percentage of the lifetime of the actual consent.” But the receiving environment or the operating environment could be quite different. That very much is a concern.

It is a light bill, but it has significant implications. This is the fundamental issue that we have a concern around in terms of the House or the Government utilising the House’s time and urgency to, effectively, ram these changes through. Again, it is a transitional measure, but why was the Government not prepared to have things in place? They’ve got two other bills that have already been introduced. They knew this change was coming. Why is it that the changes that this bill is seeking to, effectively, fast track was not foreshadowed as part of the Government’s consideration in that space?

The only information that we have in front of us, apart from the bill, is the departmental disclosure statement (DDS). There is no regulatory impact statement, and I’ve covered that, so I don’t intend to go through it. But there are a number of noes that are contained within the DDS, but there is actually one yes, and the yes pertains to retrospectivity and whether this bill affects the rights, freedoms, or imposes obligations retrospectively. It says yes, it does. Any moment that there is an imposition, whether it be retrospective or not, on the ability for someone to exercise their rights or their freedoms, does raise some questions. That’s exactly why the Resource Management Act system, in terms of these consents that have been approved and will be rolled over, would have been, at the time, considered alongside the scope of different aspects, whether it’s in a regional or a district plan, around what could or couldn’t be done. That is a legitimate point that needs to be brought into this consideration as well.

The other thing of interest is that this—and the reason why I’m relying on the DDS is because, as my colleague the Hon Priyanka Radhakrishnan had said, at this point in the process, we would have actually been talking about what the community had to say about this, what the views were of consent holders about what this impact would mean for them, if anything. Now, they might have been quite happy with that. There might be others that think, actually, no, there was a chance to pursue this quite differently. Because we don’t have that in front of the Parliament or in front of the House, we can really only rely on what it is that Government members and the Minister himself have actually provided in terms of contributions, and they have been, to be fair, fairly sparse up to this point. There is an opportunity for them to change that and to change tack to provide a bit more information and context rather than saying, “Well, we’re here to roll this over and commend the bill.” Our job is to ensure that the legislation passing through this Parliament is consistent with some of the obligations and concerns that would be expressed by the communities that we all represent.

When I look at page 6 of the DDS, there is a very clear indication around the consistency with the Government’s Treaty of Waitangi obligations. Of interest, it says that extending consents without engaging Māori raises Treaty implications, as the Crown is generally obliged to consult on proposals affecting Māori interest. Automatically, this is a Government that is not prepared to lend any weight in that particular space. However, it says, to address this, the Minister intends to inform Māori groups about the proposal.

Well, how rude is that? Not going to engage—going to inform Māori groups about the proposal. Well, he’ll be doing it within the next 24 hours, perhaps, as this has been introduced, first reading, currently on second reading. Who knows when this will end? I just think this is just poor process. It is poor process when their own departmental disclosure statement indicates that, actually, don’t worry, we’ll get around that. The Minister will address it by informing Māori groups. I think that is a sham in terms of the way in which the partnership with Māori is being reflected in the context of this particular bill.

The other sort of aspect here is the fact that this is not being subject to the normal scrutiny, which means that it leaves the Parliament without a very clear or firm or deep understanding of the evidence that exists around the costs that this change would lead to. Now, it might be that the costs that would be borne—and the Minister believes that there are no costs associated with this, except the costs of the time of the Parliament. Maybe we should rack that up to see how much that actually costs—how much the Government is prepared to spend our taxpayers’ money on urgency, because it’s a bit of a common theme at the moment. But where those costs actually fall—and with that, I think there will be some unintended consequences.

There needs to be analysis as to what this would cost and who would actually carry those costs. If it’s actually going to be that these consents are going to be rolled over for a period of time, I’m sure that everyone expects that there would still be a monitoring opportunity for councils and territorial authorities to still undertake, or is it the Government’s expectation that they’re going to roll over these consents, and only for rolled-over consents, those consents and the operations would not be subject to any ongoing monitoring or evaluation? If there is monitoring and evaluation, there will be a cost associated with that. If it’s expected that local government as a sector—and therefore councils and therefore households, through rates—are going to bear those costs, then that is something that the Government is quite happy to do. Now, that might be the position, but simply saying that there are no costs associated with this change I think is a little bit far from the bullseye in terms of where things need to land.

The lack of consultation with iwi, with local government, with stakeholders in the environmental and in the development space—I mean, this would be an opportunity for them to feed into this process. Alongside the fact that these are significant changes in terms of time, we are talking about thousands upon thousands of consents that would be an authorisation to continue activities, with conditions or without, where there has been no analysis as to what the future implications might be. If a receiving environment has changed to the extent where, actually, the nature of that activity is significantly compromised or the impact or the effect on the environment of the receiving environment is going to be so different, surely that should be subject to some form of assessment. What this bill is doing is basically preventing that opportunity by doing a blanket rollover opportunity.

I support the comments that have been expressed by the Hon Priyanka Radhakrishnan in saying that there are other options here. The transition period could be for a shorter period of time. There could be some other ways in which transition could be given effect to. I think that these transitional provisions could be dealt with in a way where councils would be able to engage with consent holders or they’d be able to approach the renewal of consents, effectively, on a case-by-case basis. There might be, actually, a suite of consents that would fall within some form of identifying feature where that was not so much of an issue. Simply saying, “Well, we’re just going to roll all of them over”, without any consideration as to changes in the environment or operations over that period of time, I think is a very, very dangerous thing. It’s not to say that it shouldn’t happen in terms of the extension of a consent, because I think we accept that there needs to be some form of transitional phasing, but this sort of blanket approach that the Government seems to want to take under urgency is one that I think is dangerous and not the way to go.

Again, I think it’s difficult given that we haven’t had an opportunity to engage with the public over this. I don’t think many members in this House will think that this is a good use of urgency, given this has been well signalled by the Government. We will continue to oppose it.

RYAN HAMILTON

National Party · Hamilton East

Thank you, Madam Speaker. It’s a pleasure to speak on this bill. Whilst I, obviously, strongly disagree with the previous speaker, this is simply a pragmatic bill while the most significant piece of legislation in a generation rolls through the House. It offers a patch-up that enables smooth continuity for our farming community and those consent holders. I’m pleased to commend it to the House.

Joseph Mooney

National Party · Southland

Thank you, Madam Speaker. I rise to make the final speech on this bill. This is a simple bill which extends consents up to two years. I would invite other members who don’t understand the point to get reading comprehension lessons. I commend this bill to the House.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the Resource Management (Duration of Consents) Amendment Bill be now read a second time.

Ayes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Noes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Motion agreed to.

Bill read a second time.

Vote: Bills

Teanau Tuiono

Assistant Speaker

This bill is set down for committee stage immediately. I declare the House in committee for consideration of the Resource Management (Duration of Consents) Amendment Bill.

In Committee

Clause 1 Title

Maureen Pugh

Chairperson

Members, the House is in committee on the Resource Management (Duration of Consents) Amendment Bill. We come to clause 1, which is the debate on the title clause. The question is that clause 1 stand part.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Thank you, Madam Chair. It’s unusual in the committee to go with the title first, but it is all in one part, so I understand that. The title is: “This Act is the Resource Management (Duration of Consents) Amendment Act”. What I’m interested in and will ask the Minister questions about as we go through this bill is the limitation of the duration of the consents. On first look, you look at this bill and you see “35 years” is mentioned at one point, but then we see this date of “31 December 2027” throughout the clauses of the bill on the next page. If he could confirm that the duration of the consents is just for those two years and if, in fact, it would be clearer for the title to be something along the lines of: “This Act is the Resource Management”—rather than “(Duration of Consents)”, it would probably be better to be “(Extension of Consents for a Maximum of Two Years)” or “(Extension of Consents to 31 December 2027)”.

If you could comment on that, because this issue of that time frame and it being limited to the two years—we’ll get to it when we’re on to clause 5, but it is relevant for the title. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Chris Penk

National Party · Kaipara ki Mahurangi

Minister for Building and Construction

I think the title of the bill is reasonably reflective of its content, and if it was as long as the member is suggesting, it would be the same length as the entire rest of the bill.

Arena Williams

Labour Party · Manurewa

Thank you, Madam Chair, for the opportunity to ask the Minister some questions about clause 1. I note that it is the tradition in this committee that clause 1 is a wide-ranging debate for members. Especially in this context, where we are debating this in all-stages urgency, it is right that we would be able to ask some questions about the purpose of this bill in this part. But can I start with some amendments to the title. I have proposed to the Minister four or five, which will be coming to him soon. I hope we can debate each of those and that he’ll have a chance to see them. Broadly, they relate to the idea that this is a transitional and savings set of provisions in this bill. Government members have had that in their speech notes today. I would agree with them, but not for the reasons they suggest.

My questions to the Minister are around including in the title of this bill that this is specifically around transitions and savings that are related to the Government’s ministerial directions that relate to planning changes. Madam Chair, if you’ll allow me, when I’m making these points, I’m thinking about, for example, the changes that are allowed by clause 5 of the Minister’s changes, new section 123C. The purpose of those is to save those resource consents that existed before ministerial directions changed planning changes, as they were in effect, and we will debate those later, but for the Minister’s information, I’ll be asking him about the interplay between Plan Change (PC) 78 and PC 120.

Given that, we think that there is a reason why these transition and savings provisions are useful. They provide natural justice to those people who were impacted when PC 120 came into effect. It is right that they might have some transitional and savings provisions. But why, then, weren’t the transitional and savings provisions provided for in legislation before those rights were extinguished? Why are we back in this committee looking at transitional and savings provisions, once those right holders that did have rights—in this case, resource consents for activities that were relying on the medium density residential standards and have now been extinguished or otherwise, and we’ll debate that in that part. But why are we now creating transitional and savings provisions? This was something that the Government members themselves pointed to consistently. They said, “Well, these are sort of transitional arrangements anyway.” Doesn’t it follow that this bill should all be seen in the context of transitional and savings provisions that should have existed in other legislation, and isn’t this what we are here for, in urgency, at a time when the Opposition hasn’t been taken through what these changes are intended to fix? If it was simply about extending the two years that Government members repeated to us ad nauseam, then surely that would have been included in another one of the resource management bills that were working their way through the House.

I would suggest that the title should reflect exactly what this is, which is a fix up of provisions that were missed. Now the Government has created a situation where there are people who had resource consents that they can no longer rely upon, and the Government knows that, and they are then creating transitional and savings provisions for future situations to avoid that.

But this isn’t just what this bill does. It is also retroactive and retrospective in effect. Why is that? If every Government member was correct that this is about the farmers, giving them a good go—I think the quote from Joseph Mooney was “two-year extension, job done”. If that was what this bill was, then it would have been included in another one of the bills that this House has debated around resource management. If it was purely about the future impact on resource consent holders, then that would have been a different discussion. But Government members know, because they have been told to say it, that this is about the transitional and savings provisions that should apply. The Minister responsible for RMA Reform should be clear about that, he should put it up front in the title, and he should address at the outset why it isn’t clearer to everyone in the House that this is a fix-up about the transitional and savings provisions that should have existed in legislation before this, or he should clarify that the other sections in this bill, which are retrospective and retroactive in impact, do not apply.

We should be clear about what we’re doing in this House, especially under all-stages urgency, where we cannot ask the experts who are advising Government, and experts from local councils, what this actually means, because there is still a lack of clarity around whether this is intended to be retroactive, and we need answers for that. If it is retroactive, it should say it in the title: “(Fix up with Retroactive Transitional and Savings Provisions) Amendment Bill”.

Lan Pham

Green Party · List MP

Thank you, Madam Chair. It is great to come straight to the title, because it says a lot about this bill, in that it’s simply referring to the duration of consents, but we know, and what is really clear from the time frames associated with the actual commencement date—and we’ve heard a lot about 2027—is that the real implication of this is more like 2031. The Government made it clear in their press release when they announced this bill. They said existing consent expiry dates will be extended to two years after the end of the transition period for the new system. Based on current expectations, this means most consents will be extended till 2031. That’s quite different to 2027, and it’s misleading with this commencement and title that that’s not actually accurately captured.

I would suggest a more accurate reflection would be “Resource Management (Delay of Environmental Improvement) Amendment Bill”. That’s not just throwing that around; the very unfortunate implications of this bill mean that the planning rules and regulations that would have otherwise applied—that sit in district plans, in unitary plans, in regional plans, and in policy statements—no longer apply. What is very concerning about that, and why I think it should be very accurately reflected in the title, is that we know a lot of these consents that will now be delayed for another two to five to six years are ones that were granted before these planning rules that the community put time, effort, consultation, and money into. They will no longer apply.

Now, the insult with that is absolutely that these communities will not have a voice when it comes to the reconsenting of these at this stage, because they’re just going to be rolled over. Particularly for iwi and hapū, that is incredibly unjust—particularly when a lot of these consents have very serious implications for sites of significance, for wāhi tapu, for wai Māori, and they just simply will not have a voice. Whether it says this bill is the “Resource Management (Delay of Environmental Improvement) Amendment Bill”; it could say this bill is the “Resource Management (Delayed Application of Planning Rules) Amendment Bill”—because, again, these are the rules that communities have actually put in place that, all things equal, if we did not have this bill, would be enacted on the consent renewal of these consents. That is a huge concern, and it’s unclear, not only from the bill itself but certainly from the bill title, that this is the case.

I think, across so many of our environmental domains—whether we’re talking about water, air, even some of our highly productive land rules—this is a huge concern and an accurate reflection of the fact that they do not apply and there will be continued delay. We’re, as yet, unclear about the actual time frame that this bill extends to the reconsenting or automatic blanket reconsenting of these consents. It would be, I think, pragmatic and do some justice to the transparency of the implications of this bill if the Minister and the Government did reconsider the title so that people actually had awareness and visibility. As I’ve already stated in the previous readings, this was part of an eight-part press release, and this is just one aspect of it. It’s very hard for communities to actually know what’s going on.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Thank you, Madam Chair. Now, in my last contribution, I was asking about the two-year time frame, and I acknowledge that that comes later in the bill, and the Minister answered, “Well, that comes later in the bill.” But I was also talking about this word “duration” versus the word “extension”. I would like an answer from the Minister on that point, because, in fact, this is all about extending consents. As we heard, there is a retrospective element to this bill as well, which is very worrying, and I know we’ll come to that later.

That’s one question. The other one is that I’d like the Minister’s comment and thoughts on the sequencing of this bill—and the relevance goes to the title as well: how you sequence different pieces of legislation—and its relationship with two other bills that have been introduced but have not yet had their first reading or gone to select committee. It seems very unusual to me that you have a transitional provision in a separate bill that comes before two other bills that have not yet been considered. That could be reflected in the title as well. It could be something like the “Resource Management (Extension of Consents to Align with Some Future Bills That Have Not Yet Been Passed)” or the “Resource Management (Extension of Consents) (the Wrong Way Around Transitional Provisions) Bill”.

This is very unusual that a Government says, “We are going to make some laws in the future, and those laws will have their own transitional provisions, and we need these laws because we brought back a piece of legislation that the previous Government had repealed, and now we’re saying that even though we haven’t debated and passed those new laws yet, we want this bill in all-stages urgency to deal with some transitional provisions that relate to those future bills.” Like, that does seem a very wrong way around way of making laws. I’m very interested in the Minister’s comments on that and how that could be reflected adequately in this title.

As we heard from Arena Williams before, in her contribution she was saying, “Well, why is it that we need this piece of legislation to look at these transitional provisions, this extension of consents, when we’ve just had in this House a number of pieces of legislation amending the Resource Management Act? If this bill was truly about the Resource Management Act rather than those other two bills that we’re going to discuss at some other point, why wasn’t it in those amendments that were amending the Resource Management Act?”

We had in front of the Environment Committee the Resource Management (Consenting and Other System Changes) Amendment Bill, and that dealt with a range of issues. We’ve also had in front of the Primary Production Committee the Resource Management (Freshwater and Other Matters) Amendment Bill. We’ve also had legislation in front of us around extending marine farms. There have been ample opportunities for this sort of legislation, if it is really about the Resource Management Act and extensions in the Resource Management Act, to come before this House. But in fact, it seems—I’m interested if the Minister can clarify it for us—that this legislation is to do with pieces of these other bills that are still in their infancy and have yet to progress through this House.

Two questions: one is about swapping out duration for extension—and, of course, I would like that to specify the two years—and then the other question is about being clear in the title about how this change does or does not relate to the other two bills that the House is going to debate at some point in the future.

Chris Penk

National Party · Kaipara ki Mahurangi

Minister for Building and Construction

Thank you, Madam Chair, and thanks to members for their contributions. I’ve made a number of notes that I think reflect points that deserve reply. In terms of the Hon Rachel Brooking’s point around extension, yes, the effect is to extend existing or expired consents, but, of course, it’s an extension of their duration, so I don’t think it’s fair to say that we’re not talking about or concerned with the duration of consents—notwithstanding that the thing that we might be doing to the duration is extending them.

In terms of other legislation that’s contemplated, as the member notes, to come into this House, yes, there’s a complex interplay. The member herself will know as well as anyone that replacing a Resource Management Act (RMA) regime is a complex endeavour. Indeed, she has experience in exactly that. But I don’t think it’s entirely reasonable to suggest that the title of this legislation should reflect all that complexity in the interplay between those other items of intended legislation.

As for the particular point under the heading that the RMA is not the sole focus of this bill and therefore, I presume, the title of the bill shouldn’t be the Resource Management (Duration of Consents) Amendment Bill, of course, to the extent that the other items of legislation will be repealing and replacing the RMA, they too, and therefore this legislation, are intimately connected with the fact of the RMA being as of now the law of the land. I think it’s entirely fair and right that the title of this legislation, being an amendment bill of the RMA, be named as such.

In terms of the points made by Arena Williams, it may be, and of course it is true, that there’s retrospectivity and/or retroactivity in the nature of the bill, but that is not a reason that we need to spell that out in the title, to my way of thinking. I think, in general terms regarding retrospectivity and/or retroactivity, the fact that there is, overall, very clearly a benefit in the extension going back in time to expired and soon-to-be-expired consents doesn’t raise the alarm bells that we’d ordinarily feel in a constitutional context—for example, introducing retrospective legislation in the criminal realm, which, of course, the New Zealand Bill of Rights Act has things to say about. As for other bills’ content, again, I think, with all due respect, it’s something of a red herring to suggest that the title of this bill—which is, of course, the clause we’re engaged in now—should refer to that in this section.

The points made by Lan Pham—I’m not entirely clear on the meaning that she’s taken from the press release, in terms of 2031 rather than 2027 being the date that’s relevant for the extension of the duration of the consents. But I would say, of course, within this committee of the whole House, we’re interested in the legislation as opposed to whatever the PR might rightly or incorrectly say. I’m not suggesting or conceding that it’s not correct, by the way, but I’m saying it’s properly the subject of this debate—what’s in the actual legislation. It’s very clear within that that the date 2027 is the relevant one, besides which it wouldn’t be appropriate to get into the detail of that within the title of the bill.

As for her characterisation of this as delaying environmental improvement, or another way of framing what she considers to be the effect of the bill, again, she might wish to propose that to the House, and the committee will have a view on that, I suppose, in terms of voting on that amendment. But we don’t see that as necessary to describe the content of the bill, which, as I emphasise again, is around amending the Resource Management Act. Hence, it’s a Resource Management Act amendment bill, and duration of consents is the way in which that is being conducted.

Damien O'Connor

Labour Party · List MP

Thank you, Madam Chair. I’ll just take a short call on the title of the bill. Points have been raised by my colleagues on the title per se, and, obviously, looking at it myself, I’d read it to be “Resource Management (Consent Extension) Amendment Act 2025”.

The questions I have of the Minister are around, I guess, the passage of this bill. It’s in 2025, but it does relate to extending consents out until 2028, effectively—31 December 2027 being, effectively, on the doorstep of 2028. The question is around the extension period. I know we have two bills about to come before us, and the assumption will be, I guess, that those bills will pass. If there is to be proper process for those bills, it might take a lot longer than the Minister thinks. The question is: does he consider that this is sufficient time to deal with all the complexities of the consents?

I’m less familiar with, and indeed we haven’t had much reference to, any consents beyond agriculture, actually, from the other side of the House. The assumption is that this is being done for farmers who will need to renew their consents—indeed, a lot of them through Environment Canterbury—and that there was a big panic there, so the Government stepped in to do this, which may or may not be positive. I’ve raised those points before in my other speech. One of the questions, in terms of the timing—and the title relates to the timing; it could be extended out—and I’ll ask this maybe later in discussion on the committee stage of the bill. It is really important to know whether the title or the timing of the bill would have been changed, and why it has been determined for the periods that we have within it—therefore, reference to consent extensions or duration of consents, which the Minister and his colleagues have put before the House.

One of the questions I have to ask is: are there any members of the House who may be affected by the extension of any of these consents? It is actually a really critical question. I raise it now in the title of the bill because it might affect the timing and, therefore, the title of what the bill could be in its format, even through this brief passage in the House—what it could, or should, end up looking like. I think the Minister will have to answer that question at some point. It may be asked again: is there any member of the coalition Government who might be affected in any way by the timing, by the renewal or extension or duration of the consents that we’re talking about here? It’s a critical point, I think, and one worthy of some consideration by the Minister.

Chris Penk

National Party · Kaipara ki Mahurangi

Minister for Building and Construction

Thank you very much, Madam Chair. I can’t speak for all members of the coalition in Government, but I would hope and expect that the rules in the Cabinet Manual around conflicts of interest would be observed, and I’ve got no reason to believe that that wouldn’t be the case in relation to how a consent’s duration might affect them personally.

As for the title of the bill including the date “2025” in clause 1—which is, of course, the title clause—that’s in bold to indicate that the reasonable expectation is that it will pass and be assented to by the Governor-General in this year. But if it’s not, that then automatically becomes the date on which that actually does take place. It could, feasibly, be the case—and let us all hope it’s not the case—that this committee of the whole House stage takes place for the next 19 days—

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

We’re hoping—we’re hoping.

Chris Penk

National Party · Kaipara ki Mahurangi

I know, right? I’m with you! If that’s the case, that wouldn’t be a problem in terms of what is recorded here.

RYAN HAMILTON

National Party · Hamilton East

I move, That debate on this question now close.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That debate on this question now close.

Ayes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Noes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Motion agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Maureen Pugh

Chairperson

The question is that Arena Williams’ tabled amendment to clause 1, inserting the words “(Addition of Savings and Transitional Arrangements)” be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Maureen Pugh

Chairperson

The question is that Dr Lawrence Xu-Nan’s tabled amendment to clause 1 be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Maureen Pugh

Chairperson

Arena Williams’ tabled amendment to clause 1 is ruled out of order as not being an objective description of the bill.

Rachel Boyack’s two tabled amendments to clause 1 are ruled out of order as not being an objective description of the bill.

Lan Pham’s tabled amendment to clause 1 is ruled out of order as not being in the correct form of legislation.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That clause 1 be agreed to.

Ayes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Noes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Clause 1 agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Maureen Pugh

Chairperson

Members, it’s now time for the dinner break. The House is suspended until 7.30.

Sitting suspended from 6.01 p.m. to 7.30 p.m.

Clause 2 Commencement

Teanau Tuiono

Chairperson

Members, the committee is resumed on the Resource Management (Duration of Consents) Amendment Bill. We were last debating the bill before the dinner break. We’d completed the debate on clause 1. We now come to clause 2. This is the debate on the commencement of the bill. The question is that clause 2 stand part.

Arena Williams

Labour Party · Manurewa

Thank you, Mr Chair, for the opportunity to take a call on the commencement date. There are a few amendments on the Table that I will invite the Minister responsible for RMA Reform to consider. I know he has not had them for long, given that we’re in all-stages urgency, but I welcome his feedback on those.

The main contention here is that given it is Christmas time and we’re missing key people in the process of Royal assent, would it not be more sensible for the Minister to amend this clause to include a power to set the date by Order in Council? That’s something which is quite ordinary for this Government to do. In fact, the pieces of resource management legislation that we have considered have had parts or the entire bill with dates which are relatively flexible in them. Given that this is a bill that introduces transitional and savings provisions that have a time impact, would it not be more sensible to be able to have this debate and to then allow the executive to set a time that was later?

Some of the amendments that I have proposed to the Minister set a date for the executive to consider an Order in Council date-setting provision after a certain time, and then some of them provide for the executive to be able to set that date after a certain date but to consider it at any time. Those are different. It is useful here that we are able to traverse with the Minister when he intends for this to come into effect, because, as the Minister who was in the chair before him noted, some of these provisions have retrospective effect.

To be able to give us the most flexibility here, it would be useful to then be able to have an Order in Council provision in the commencement date clause but also for the Minister to then discuss, as this is his only chance to do so—we don’t have a select committee stage to be able to ask these questions—what the timing provisions that are on his mind are. If this was to come into effect tomorrow, would there be any material difference to it coming into effect at, say, the end of January next year? That will be on the minds of some of the groups that are affected here.

From the departmental disclosure statement that we’ve been provided with today, we also note Māori groups have not been consulted about the implications of this bill, but instead the Minister intends to tell them about it, which is a bit different from consultation. Nevertheless, would it not be more sensible for the executive to have a power to set the date so that these provisions would come into effect to allow the Minister to do that—to inform the groups which he proposes to work with?

It notes here that “the Crown is generally obliged to consult on proposals affecting Māori interests. To address this, the Minister intends to inform Māori groups about the proposal.” If that is a mere sort of information-sharing exercise, it should be short, but perhaps the Minister can give us a time frame in which he would expect that he would be able to inform these Māori groups. Be it by letter or by face-to-face meetings—either one of those shouldn’t take too long. I’ll bet that a number of people out there are keen to engage with him on this, and so surely it would be useful for the House to allow a number of weeks for that informing process to happen.

Mind you, colleagues, we are in slightly unusual territory here, where consultation like this would often take the Government anywhere between six weeks and six months. That’s not what we are proposing here in the time it might take to change the commencement date clause. We’re simply saying that if consultation is not to occur—it’s not what we would choose; we would choose to do the consultation that we think is an obligation of the Government under Te Tiriti o Waitangi. But if a Government was so minded to skip that consultation requirement, then would it not be reasonable for the executive to have some flexibility to allow that informing process to happen in a way which was respectful of the rights and interests that are at play here?

It would also allow for officials to be able to gather the information about what consents are impacted. Officials have provided advice around the 35-year water consents being about the length that you might have an extension for, and more than that might impact very unfairly on Māori rights. It would allow them more time to actually work out what consents those were, and to engage with the impacted hapū and iwi for whom those consents are within a catchment area that they are kaitiaki of. That would allow the Minister to do this important work, which officials have noted is already under way anyway.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

This is a relatively simple question with a relatively simple answer: the Act comes into force on the day after Royal assent. The Government is not proposing to change that. For the reasons outlined in the first and second reading debates, the Government wants to provide certainty as quickly as possible, so as soon as we can get the Royal assent done, we will, and it comes into effect the day after Royal assent.

Lawrence Xu-Nan

Green Party · List MP

Thank you, Mr Chair, and thank you to the Minister for that response. I do support the member Arena Williams’ amendment, because I have exactly the same amendment as well, which is to consider, rather than a specific date, a date set by Order in Council. Now, I hear what the Minister is saying in terms of the first and second reading, but contrary to what the Minister said, based on what we have in terms of the departmental disclosure statement and the lack of any other form of information, this is anything but clear.

In terms of confidence, I would be curious to know exactly to whom is this confidence that the Minister is speaking of or referring to, is supposed be—because it certainly isn’t for collective groups that the member Arena Williams has just stated. I do think it is important for the Minister to consider such amendments when we are looking at it as we are going through the bill, because there are definitely a number of things in other areas I will speak to at the later clauses on—well, on clarifications, not necessarily concerns but clarifications, that we’re seeking from the Minister.

But just on the date itself, in terms of “This Act comes into force on the day after Royal assent.”, I do want to check with the Minister if other things have been considered—you know, for example, was a date set by Order in Council considered as part of that?

As we see in a number of other things, including within the Resource Management Act itself, a lot of the dates that are specified are not specified per se but specified in the context of either by Order in Council or certain discretions or based on the kind of consent that is being applied for. Indeed, that’s some of the things that we’re seeing later on, in both the Natural Environment Bill and also in terms of the Planning Bill.

With that in mind, I did want to check with the Minister before, and also just ask the Minister to consider the amendment, again, on how is this bill supposed to give confidence to people when the fact that the departmental disclosure statement says that no consultation was done and there’s, basically, very, very little information that has been related to this?

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Thank you, Mr Chair. My question about the commencement is just slightly related, I think, to that last contribution—that is, the relationship of this through those other bills that have not yet had any debate in this House and have not been sent to select committee.

I was wondering if the Minister responsible for RMA Reform would consider—and he might want to comment, given that he is now in the chair, on the unusualness of the situation whereby there is a transitional provision coming for legislation that’s not yet had a first reading that is in a separate piece of legislation. I mean, that just seems like an incredibly unusual thing to be doing. I would be interested in the Minister’s comment on how that works and how that sequencing of the bills—because, I don’t know, it could be that the commencement comes into force the day after those other bills are reported back or some other trigger that is actually related to those other bills. At the moment, this just seems like a random extension to consents for perhaps two years—and we’ll get into the two years soon, but I’m wondering what other considerations have gone into that commencement and also what the urgency is here.

Now, the Minister said before in a speech or in a motion that they want to get on and do the resource management reforming, but why is this urgent now? There was the comment made that “Well, this will provide some relief for different consent holders.” Why does it matter today? It’s come in all stages of urgency today and will commence as soon as it has had its Royal assent, and there’s no post-enactment review or anything like that. Those things don’t make very much sense to me, and I look forward to the Minister’s answer.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

I don’t have a lot more to add to what has already been traversed. The Government’s laid out, I think, a pretty clear transition plan. As I said during the second reading debate, any transition to a new regime is going to be relatively complex. There are a range of things in the Planning Bill and the Natural Environment Bill that are not subject to this bill, but the member did ask about them.

The intention of this bill, in the short term, is to provide some immediate certainty for those people who are stuck in the current consenting framework. Some of my colleagues, during the first and second reading debates, have made mention of some of those difficult situations that people have found themselves in. If this bill passes, there’ll be an immediate two-year extension transition while the bills work their way through the select committee—the Planning Bill and the Natural Environment Bill. Then those bills have a consent extension provision in there as well, which is, essentially, a twoyear extension beyond when the system turns on.

We don’t know exactly when the system will turn on. We roughly estimate around 2029—that’s certainly what we’ll be aiming for. There’s a whole lot of work to do, between the spatial plans and the regional combined plans and the natural direction underneath the new bills. There’s quite a lot of work to do in the next three years, and so it’s a layered approach. You’ve got the bill that we’re debating currently, and you’ve got the consent extensions in the transitional phase of the Planning Bill and the Natural Environment Bill. Then some bits of it—and this is where it does get a little bit complicated—some bits of the new regime will turn on straight away. Things around proportionality and some of the procedural principles, for example, will turn on straight away, so people will be able to get the benefits of that straight away. It’s complicated in one sense, but on the other hand, it’s also not that complicated—whereas this bill is actually, as I say, a simple bill.

Members are interested as to whether or not the Government will consider a change to the commencement date. The answer to that is no, for the reasons that I’ve said twice now, which is that we want immediate certainty.

Ms Brooking asks around, “Why now?” Well, don’t take this the wrong way, but why not? This is the day we’ve announced our Resource Management Act (RMA) reforms, and, clearly, the RMA reforms have—well, even the anticipation and the lead-up to them have made people say, “Well, hang on a minute, I’m in the consenting queue right now. What’s going on? Am I going to get a consent? You know, my council’s buggerising around. I need some certainty.”

The intention is to do that but also is cognisant of the fact that we do need to move to a new system. We’re not leaving the RMA stuck in formaldehyde. That would be a very bad idea. We think we’ve created a better and new system, but we need to get to that system, and getting there is not an immediate thing. It’s not like you just pass a new piece of legislation and then everything turns on straight away. That’s not the reality. It wasn’t the reality under the Natural and Built Environment Act of the previous Government. It’s not the reality under this Government, either. That will never be the reality. That would cause absolute chaos. I think this is an elegant way through. Members are entitled to disagree, but that’s the rationale for the Government’s actions.

Lan Pham

Green Party · List MP

Thank you, Mr Chair. I don’t intend to take up any more time than necessary. I would like to ask for a clarification of the Minister responsible for RMA Reform’s comments just now, particularly around those time frames. We heard earlier a real downplaying of what was, at least, in the press release about the time frames, which said that “Existing consent expiry dates will be extended to two years after the end of the transition period for the new system.” As I hear it, the Minister is confirming that there are going to be various stages, but we’re expecting, roughly, for it to be 2029, and then you’re saying that then that it could be a two-year period after that, to 2031. Why does it say, “Based on current expectations, this means most consents will extend to 2031.”?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

Well, it’s just maths, right? If we turn the system on in 2029, two years after 2029 is—the last time I looked—2031. That’s just maths.

Lan Pham

Green Party · List MP

Thank you. Why were you downplaying it previously, when you’re saying that it is actually 2031? It’s not just two years; it’s actually 2031, which is five to six years.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister of Housing

This bill is two years, and so it’s December 2027, OK? That’s what this bill does. The Planning Bill and the Natural Environment Bill, which we’re not currently debating—we will next week, and you’ll get a chance to have a thrash next week on that, too.

Those bills, which we introduced today, but they won’t get their first reading until next week—that sets up quite an elaborate, quite complicated transition regime. Elements of that regime are things that the member has picked up on, which is the two years after the system turns on—which, as I say, we expect to be around 2029, but between now and 2029, there are a whole lot of things that have to happen: (1) we’ve got to pass the bills to start with, and then there’s going to be a whole select committee process; and (2) there are two tranches of national direction to bring into effect. One is called the national policy direction, and the other layer is national standards or national instruments. Those will happen in two tranches.

Now, we’re not starting from a blank sheet of paper on that, because some of the work that we’ve done over the last 24 months in relation to national direction will port into the new system. For example, the National Policy Statement on Urban Development and the National Policy Statement for Renewable Electricity Generation, which has been strengthened, have picked up on some of the work of the last Government. A new policy statement on infrastructure and national environmental standards on granny flats, for example, which the Government has been working on—there’s a whole range of different things. There’s papa kāinga, as well. Those things will port into the new system, and so that’s got to happen—that’s number two.

Three, there are plans that have got to be developed—new spatial plans—and then land-use chapters as part of the combined regional plans. There’s a lot of work to be done there.

Basically, once all of that stuff has happened—which, to be honest, is quite a lot to do in three years. I think that with a fair wind behind us, we can do it, but it’s quite a bit of work. Once that happens, the new system will, essentially, turn on. It’s brought in by Order in Council, by the Government. Arena Williams was making a point before about how the Government likes Orders in Council. It’s not that we like it; it’s just that it’s an effective device for turning systems on—

Arena Williams

Labour Party · Manurewa

Put one in here.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

No, I’m not doing that. Then it’s two years after that. Now, is there a debate to be had about two years versus one year? Absolutely, there’s a debate to be had around that. We’ll send it to a select committee and have a look at it, but you’ve got to give people time for the new system to get in, right? Once the new system is in place with the plans and the national direction, there still needs to be a bit of time after that for people to transition into that new system.

Is two years the right length of time? That’s what the Government’s current proposition is. We could have a debate about that. Reasonable people can disagree around it, but that’s actually nothing to do with this bill.

This bill provides immediate certainty for people right now, but don’t get confused by the 2031 thing. This bill just does a two-year extension for things that are currently in the system to provide certainty before Christmas for those people and their consents.

Lan Pham

Green Party · List MP

Taking that and noting everything that you’ve just said—which was my understanding—the implication of exactly what you were describing of that process is that the date is not 2027; the effective date is 2031. The Minister can point to the bill as much as he wants, and the previous Minister in the chair was doing the same “Oh, don’t worry about the press release.”, when you’re just saying that the implications of your own process, the material impact, is 2031. Now, that should matter—

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

No—no, sorry. The press release is really clear: it’s about the Planning Bill and the Natural Environment Bill. The press release also says that there will be urgent legislation. This bill, which does the two-year consent extensions—there’s no secret about this. It’s all in the public domain.

This bill does not extend consents until 2031—it does not. It does not do that. It does not say that in this bill. It does it until December 2027.

I know that the member is worked up about the other stuff, but to be honest, that bill is, like, next week, and we can have a debate about that then and at select committee. This bill is a really simple, very short bill—that’s all it is.

Lan Pham

Green Party · List MP

Is it the case, then, that the press release about the transition to the new system is completely wrong?

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Thank you. I’ve heard the Minister Responsible for RMA Reform talk about the transitional provisions in the new system and the complexity of turning that system on, and that you’ll have elements that are immediate and elements that come later, and that we will discuss that in select committee, because that bill is going to go to a select committee.

What I don’t understand, and I haven’t heard from the Minister, apart from it being near Christmas, is why we have this bill in front of us now with the two-year extension—and he’s confirmed that it’s a two-year extension—and whether he expects that if something happens with the other set of legislation, the two-year extension in this bill will have to be amended in the future. Are we expecting to come back to this bill is my question there.

Related to that, again, putting it: what justification is there for this coming through all-stages urgency, with no regulatory impact statement and with the department disclosure assessment just saying no, no, no to everything—that there’s really no analysis? The Minister, I think, referred to this in his second reading speech, as well—that we don’t know how many consents are affected.

On the commencement clause, it’s: why this need for haste when we don’t have the information? We could, as a Parliament, take some time to work through what the consequences are and whether or not, then, there is a good reason for doing an extension to some consents; if the right consents are covered; if two years is the right time frame, given what’s going to come in the other legislation; and whether or not there should be any risk assessments on the type of consents that are being affected.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

In terms of the justification, I’ve answered that three or four times now. The member makes a good point around “are we expected to come back?”. The answer is no, because once the Planning Bill and the Natural Environment Bill pass at some point next year, they will take effect. They’ll get Royal assent, they’ll come into effect, and then the new transition regime kicks in, and the Resource Management Act at that point will be repealed, and so this consent transition thing will fall away at that point.

The December 2027 backstop, if you like, is, essentially, a belts and braces approach, but the intention is for Parliament to pass the bills next year. That’s certainly my aim. There’s a chance that they won’t, I suppose—who knows what will happen—but that’s certainly the aim. But this is a belts and braces approach to provide certainty, and that’s literally all there is to it. It’s not actually that complicated, to be honest.

Damien O'Connor

Labour Party · List MP

Thank you, Mr Chair. One of the questions I have is the size of the problem here. Because we don’t have a RIS—a regulatory impact statement—we’re really kind of working in the dark a bit. Like, how big is this problem? If the commencement date doesn’t happen this year, as the Minister responsible for RMA Reform implies, if for some reason—and I’d like to think I’m an optimist, but having been in Government through a period of many interventions from left field, or right field for some of it, the fact is that things can intervene. If this commencement date wasn’t after Royal assent and it wasn’t this year—it was pushed out—then could the Minister answer what’s the size of the problem? How many consents would be affected, and in what particular sectors? I guess, if the Minister says this is a transitional arrangement to allow his two pieces of legislation to roll through, then if it doesn’t happen this year, if the Royal assent doesn’t happen in a smooth passage over the next week or so, then what will happen and to who? That is, how many consents will be affected? How many people will be operating outside of the law, and whether that is significant if this was to perhaps commence at the end of January or some other period that the Governor-General gets to sign this off? Maybe the Minister can take a call and answer those things.

Arena Williams

Labour Party · Manurewa

Thank you, Mr Chair, and I thank the Minister responsible for RMA Reform for his helpful answer to my questions about the amendments. I take on board that he’s not going to change the date, so I just want to ask him, in light of his comments around providing certainty as his justification for not changing the commencement date—it is important that the law should be certain—and, really, the question is: when does he expect Royal assent to be given?

My question to him was about: it is Christmas time. We have key people in the process of Royal assent who must be involved. Are those people available should this bill pass three days hence, because we’ll be continuing on with this committee of the whole House stage until then? When does he expect Royal assent to be given? Is it this side of Christmas? What certainty is there, when Royal assent isn’t part of that—you know, it’s not a date. He could pick a date; he hasn’t done that.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

I think we’re into the realm of the absurd now. I have great respect for the Governor-General, but I do not pick her timetable, and so whenever the bill has passed its third reading, it will get sent at some point to Her Excellency, and I’ve no doubt she will sign on the dotted line.

Arena Williams

Labour Party · Manurewa

That’s not very certain, is it?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Well, it doesn’t—like, who knows? Who knows? She runs her own diary; I don’t. I have many powers, but I don’t have that, so let’s wait and see. The point is that it’s the day after whenever that happens. My expectation would be in the next week or so. We are—what are we? December 9. Christmas is 16 days away. You guys might clock off early, but certainly we will be working hard. There’s no doubt the Governor-General will be as well.

In relation to Mr O’Connor’s question, how many? I answered this in the—

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Because we don’t live in Wellington.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

What’s that?

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

That’s rude. We might pop off—that’s because we don’t live in Wellington. Not all of us can live here.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Well, not all of us can live in the greatest city on planet Earth, Rachel. Some of us have to—

Tom Rutherford

National Party · Bay of Plenty

Some live on Waiheke.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Well, ha, ha! In relation to Mr O’Connor’s question: how many? It’s a good question. I answered this in the second reading debate. We don’t know exactly how many, partly because the Resource Management Act is such a dog in terms of the digital systems. We don’t actually know. We roughly estimate between 2,000 and 2,500 consents, but that’s a back of the envelope number, so it’s about that many.

Tom Rutherford

National Party · Bay of Plenty

I move, That debate on this question now close.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That debate on this question now close.

Ayes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Noes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Motion agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Teanau Tuiono

Chairperson

The question is that Arena Williams’ tabled amendment to clause 2, replacing “the day after Royal assent” with “1 January 2026” be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Teanau Tuiono

Chairperson

The question is that Arena Williams’ tabled amendment to clause 2, replacing “the day after Royal assent” with “6 February 2026” be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Teanau Tuiono

Chairperson

The question is that the Hon Rachel Brooking’s tabled amendment to clause 2, replacing “the day after Royal assent” with “1 March 2026” be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Teanau Tuiono

Chairperson

The question is that the Hon Rachel Brooking’s tabled amendment to clause 2, replacing “the day after Royal assent” with “1 April 2026” be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Teanau Tuiono

Chairperson

The question is that Dr Lawrence Xu Nan’s tabled amendment to clause 2 be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Teanau Tuiono

Chairperson

There are a number of amendments to clause 2 from Arena Williams that provide for the bill to commence on a day set by Order in Council after a specified period. Because they are very similar in nature, I will select three of them for the committee to consider.

The question is that Arena Williams’ tabled amendment to clause 2, replacing “the day after Royal assent” with “a day set by Order in Council that is at least 6 weeks after Royal assent” be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Teanau Tuiono

Chairperson

The question is that Arena Williams’ tabled amendment to clause 2, replacing “the day after Royal assent” with “a day set by Order in Council that is at least 6 months after Royal assent” be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Teanau Tuiono

Chairperson

The question is that Arena Williams’ tabled amendment to clause 2, replacing “the day after Royal assent” with “a day set by Order in Council that is after 12 December 2026” be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Teanau Tuiono

Chairperson

Arena Williams’ remaining tabled amendments to clause 2 are ruled out of order as being the same in substance as amendments that have already been put to the committee.

The question is that clause 2 stand part.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That clause 2 be agreed to.

Ayes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Noes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Clause 2 agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Clause 3 Principal Act

Teanau Tuiono

Chairperson

Members, we now come to clause 3. Clause 3 is the debate on the principal Act. The question is that clause 3 stand part.

Lawrence Xu-Nan

Green Party · List MP

Thank you, Mr Chair. I think clause 3 is one of the more substantial parts of this bill, because, again, although we’ve touched on some of the other bills that are being introduced—in terms of the Natural Environment Bill but also the Planning Bill—I think the idea that this bill amends the Resource Management Act (RMA) is significant in lieu of a select committee stage and any advice from officials. This particular clause allows us to ask the Minister responsible for RMA Reform maybe some broader questions in terms of the policy intent of this bill and the magnitude—that it affects the Resource Management Act.

In terms of the remainder of this section, we do see that this is supposed to be limited to consent and duration of consent. But I guess my first question to the Minister—and I’m sure that my colleagues will have other questions on the implications that this will have to the broader understanding of the Resource Management Act—is whether there are other aspects that were considered as also being amended as part of this bill, or whether this is the only part? That’s the first question.

The second part of this question would be: is, then, section 123, in terms of the duration of consent, the only section within the Resource Management Act that the Minister considered in terms of increasing the duration of consent, or are there other sections within the Resource Management Act that are also relevant to the duration of consent that aren’t captured as a part of this bill? Those are my first two questions.

I guess another question is, as we’re looking at some of the clauses that will be covered a little bit later, just even looking at the Resource Management Act—and, of course, I’m no expert when it comes to the RMA, but it is interwoven and interlocking in terms of various subclauses within the entirety of that Act. I just—again, under urgency, considering we have not seen this bill and it hasn’t gone to the select committee stage—want reassurance from Ministers that all potential fish-hooks within different subsections that are affected by the changes that are being made in this legislation to the Resource Management Act are also well captured within this piece of the bill.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

This is the most narrow clause on the planet. It is about the principal Act, and the purpose of these clauses is to indicate to the Parliament what the amendment bill is amending. This is the resource management duration of consents. The amendment bill is amending the Resource Management Act (RMA), because we are dealing with resource management consents. That’s literally all the clause says. The clause says the Act is amending the Resource Management Act 1991, because it is. It doesn’t affect other Acts, and the reason it doesn’t affect any other Act is because the intention is not to amend any other Act; it deals with the RMA. That’s literally all it is, and we don’t need to spend any time considering whether or not we should amend any other Acts, because the bill’s purpose is in the name. It is an amendment to the Resource Management Act. It’s not an omnibus bill. That’s all it is. The principal Act—in clause 3, it says it amends the RMA. It’s that simple.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Thank you, Mr Chair. Look, I take the Minister responsible for RMA Reform’s point that this is about the Resource Management Act (RMA) only and it’s not about the future bills that we’re yet to debate, even though they’re related. I’d just like to get the Minister’s confirmation about that. In some of the material I saw today, there was discussion around these various different transitional and extension provisions. It read as if some of the changes were to those other pieces of legislation rather than this principal Act. My point is can he confirm that this bill is just about the Resource Management Act, the future legislation will repeal the RMA, and they will have their own transitional provisions that will be separate?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

Yes, I can confirm that. This just deals with the Resource Management Act (RMA). We’ve traversed the two years and how long and all the rest of it. It’s that simple. The RMA Planning Bill will come into effect at some point next year. It’s a whole other bespoke regime which will pull over consents issued under the RMA into the new system, obviously, and the RMA will wither away on the vine, back into the dustbin of history, where many people wished it were until now.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Just like it was in August 2023.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

I think it was later than August 2023, wasn’t it? But anyway, I take your point. I know what you’re referring to. We’ll finally do away with it in the spirit of bipartisanship, and Christmas bonhomie will break out across all the land.

Tangi Utikere

Labour Party · Palmerston North

No.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

No? Apparently not. OK. Well, one can only hope.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Show us the bill first.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

The bill’s—I’ve introduced it. It’s on the floor of the House—oh, you’re talking about this one?

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Yeah.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Yeah, well, it’s available now too. It’s literally a five-clause bill. It’s not that complicated. Anyway, it just affects the RMA.

Lawrence Xu-Nan

Green Party · List MP

Just a very small follow-up question for the Minister responsible for RMA Reform. I understand that this clause just amends the Resource Management Act, but I want to check with the Minister: does it need amending in the first place? Again, I don’t know the Resource Management Act myself, but I’m checking with the Minister if there is any other regulatory-making power that would have achieved the same goal and outcomes as expected—as the Minister wanted to do with this particular bill? I don’t know. Is there any other regulatory-making power that would have avoided a bill being introduced in the House in the first place, in urgency?

Teanau Tuiono

Chairperson

Just before I take another call, if I can ask members to focus on this very narrow clause. The Minister has addressed a number of the issues—probably not to the satisfaction of some members—but it is a narrow clause, and if I could ask members to focus on the narrowness of it and not to step outside that, that would be very helpful.

Damien O'Connor

Labour Party · List MP

Thank you very much, Mr Chairman. I will say—I won’t take unnecessary time—but I think it is important, given the absence of a select committee, to ask a few questions. If you go further down in the bill—and it relates back to this clause—of course, we’re talking about resource consents relating to water. The questions around the Act it should be amending—and the Minister responsible for RMA Reform has got in the bill here, of course, the Resource Management Act. My questions are: did he consider looking at the valuation Act? If this bill didn’t go through, will that have affected the valuation of any of the land, and, indeed, if that had been considered, perhaps it should have been in the regulatory impact statement (RIS), but I know we don’t have a RIS. That’s why I’m raising the question.

The other one is the Local Government Act. There may be implications through this because of the change to water, or, actually, the securing of the permits to continue, but given the different circumstances that the councils might find themselves in now in addressing these applications for resource consents, then maybe the Local Government Act should have been amended and should have been one of the principal Acts referred to in clause 3, alongside the Resource Management Act.

Maybe the Minister can say: had he considered or was there any advice or would the RIS have included any reference to the effect on the evaluation of the property of all sorts—the property that is being reconsented, although consents are being extended—and, indeed, is there any impact on local government for the management of this, and was there a need to look at amendments to the Local Government Act?

STUART SMITH

National Party

Senior Whip

I move, That debate on this question now close.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That debate on this question now close.

Ayes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Noes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Motion agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That clause 3 be agreed to.

Ayes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Noes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Clause 3 agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Clause 4 Section 123 amended (Duration of Consent)

Teanau Tuiono

Chairperson

Members, we now come to clause 4. Clause 4 is the debate on the amendment to section 123, the duration of consent. The question is that clause 4 stand part.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

This is really a clarification question and explanation—and the Minister can tell me if I’m correct or not—about what this clause is doing. Section 123—it’s a good number, isn’t it? The duration of consent at section 123(1) gives the different time frames for different types of consents and how long they can last for. For example, in section 123(1)(aa) of the principal Act: “the period for which a resource consent for an activity that meets the requirements of a wastewater environmental performance standard or a stormwater environmental performance standard is granted is 35 years:”. Then, at subsection (2): “Despite anything in subsection (1), the period of an extant wastewater consent (as defined in section 139B) may be extended as specified in section 139C.” Beautiful Resource Management Act - amended drafting there.

But what we’re looking at here is section 123 stays, but then we’ve got this addition, “Despite anything in subsection (1)”—which is those different time frames for the different types of consents—that the period of a resource consent to which new section 123C applies are the periods specified in that section.

We will come to new section 123C in a minute, because that is what is inserted by clause 5. My question is really very simple, and it’s just for the Minister to confirm and I guess to give us some comfort that the only amendment, really, to section 123 is what is then later described in clause 5, which is the new section 123C inserted.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

Madam—sorry, Mr. My apologies.

Teanau Tuiono

Chairperson

Apology accepted.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

It’s been quite a long day.

Tangi Utikere

Labour Party · Palmerston North

It’s going to get longer.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Yes—well, I understand we’re going through until 10 p.m., so, yes, that is definitely true. Time marches on. It’s an amazing thing.

I’ve got an answer, which is, basically, that this is a tidy-up to ensure that new section 123C is not limited by section 123, so as to ensure that new section 123C—which, as the member notes, is, essentially, the chunk of the bill, the operative part of the bill in clause 5—takes precedence for affected consents. It’s just the drafting that’s complicated.

Lawrence Xu-Nan

Green Party · List MP

Thank you, Mr Chair. I want to check something with the Minister responsible for RMA Reform and also ask the Minister to consider one of my amendments to this section. Now, the wording for this section is: “(3) Despite anything … the period … to which section 123C applies is the period specified in that section.” The use of the verb “is” makes it absolute, so you have to follow. However, if we’re looking at the original section 123, and we’re looking at section 123(2), which is also an exception to subsection (1), it says in there, “Despite anything in subsection (1), the period of an extant wastewater consent … may be extended as specified in [a different section].”

My Amendment Paper replaces the word “is” with “may be”, on the one hand to be consistent with also what’s in section 123(2), and on the other hand to allow for flexibility to the practicality of the extension to the duration of a consent. It allows for the flexibility that while what we see in clause 5 is there, it is not absolute and is not mandated. I just want to check with the Minister if the Minister would consider that. I do think that consistency between subsection (2) and subsection (3), which is in this bill, is an important one.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

The short answer is no. The clause is really clear, as I’ve just read out literally to the member’s colleague exactly what it does.

Arena Williams

Labour Party · Manurewa

I also want to clarify the provisions that apply to section 123(2) of the principal Act, just in light of what the Minister responsible for RMA Reform said—that it stops new section 123C, inserted by clause 5, being read down from what exists in section 123(1) now. I just want to clarify for the Minister that section 123(1) is the section which sets out the standard durations for consent, but section 123(2), which this amends, is just about waste water. Is the Minister suggesting that the provisions do or don’t apply to the waste-water provision set out at section 123(2)? Those are the provisions which have special rules that allow for ongoing waste-water consents to be extended under the special rules under section 139C.

Or does this apply to everything that’s set out in section 123(1), which is venues, consents, coastal payments—like, that’s everything? Then I would have some different questions about his amendments at clause 5, which creates new section 123C.

Grant McCallum

National Party · Northland

I move, That debate on this question now close.

Lawrence Xu-Nan

Green Party · List MP

I guess just a very small follow-up to the question I had to the Minister responsible for RMA Reform before. I understand what the Minister is saying, but, again, what we don’t know is if other alternatives have been considered. When we’re looking at this clause, what is the rationale—I get it: it’s clear; I can read that—of using an absolute “is” as opposed to a subjunctive “may”, as you see with subsection (2) of section 123, which has a similar provision. That’s my main question to the Minister, because, I mean, I don’t mind if that is an active consideration by the Minister between the two variations, but I would like to know that is a genuinely considered decision that was made, not simply because that would have been logical, or whether or not this is just how it was drafted or it was drafted in haste. It would be good to know from the Minister if this was an active intent to make it absolute.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

I don’t have anything much more to add, other than I’m not going to get into a debate tonight about the meaning of the word “is”. OK, I’ll just say that one for the record.

Lawrence Xu-Nan

Green Party · List MP

Literally, that’s what we are doing.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Well, the member can yell into the void about the word “is” if he would like, but I’m not going to entertain a debate about it.

Clause 4 is relatively simple. It says, “Despite anything in subsection (1), [a] period of a resource consent to which 123C applies is [this] period specified in that section”, and then clause 5 inserts new section 123C, which goes through a schema of various different consents that are then extended for two years. The member has rightly noted the various different things about waste water. We can have a debate around that in the next section. But this is just almost like a prefatory clause to get to the actual operative clause. That’s all there is to it.

Catherine Wedd

National Party · Tukituki

I move, That debate on this question now close.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That debate on this question now close.

Ayes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Noes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Motion agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Teanau Tuiono

Chairperson

The question is that Helen White’s tabled amendment to clause 4 be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Teanau Tuiono

Chairperson

The Hon Rachel Brooking’s tabled amendment to delete clause 4 is ruled out of order as being a direct negation of the question.

Arena Williams’ tabled amendment to clause 4, new section 123(3), inserting “in future” is ruled out of order as not being in the correct form of legislation.

The Hon Rachel Brooking’s tabled amendment to clause 4, section 123(3), inserting “in future and not in any way retrospectively” is ruled out of order as not being in the correct form of legislation.

The Hon Rachel Brooking’s tabled amendment to clause 4, section 123(3), inserting “from the date of commencement” is ruled out of order as not being in the correct form of legislation.

Dr Lawrence Xu-Nan’s tabled amendment to clause 4, section 123(3), replacing “is” with “may be” is ruled out of order as not offering a serious alternative form of words.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That clause 4 be agreed to.

Ayes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Noes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Clause 4 agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Clause 5 New section 123C inserted (Duration of certain current and continued consents)

Teanau Tuiono

Chairperson

Members, we now come to clause 5. Clause 5 is the debate on the new section 123C, “Duration of certain current and continued consents”. The question is that clause 5 stand part.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Thank you, Mr Chair. I do have a number of questions on this clause, it being the big one in the bill, but I will start at the start, although other members may have questions that jump around a bit.

What I want to start with is at new section 123C(1)(b). It says there “a resource consent that expired before the commencement date, but only if,—(i) immediately before the commencement date, the holder was eligible to operate under the consent in reliance on section 124; and (ii) the holder’s application for a new consent had not been determined by the consent authority before the commencement date.” The questions about this clause are the retrospective element that comes here and how that then relates to the two years that the Minister has been talking about.

Resource consents are binary—you either have a resource consent or you don’t have a resource consent. If a resource consent has expired, that means you don’t have a resource consent, yet what this provision seems to be doing is saying despite the fact that your resource consent has expired and you don’t have a resource consent before the commencement date, we’re still going to give you an extension.

I’m wondering if the Minister responsible for RMA Reform can comment on that and how it will work, and the justification for it as well, noting that there are two requirements—there is an “if”, and then there is a (i) and a (ii) with an “and” in between. The first one is that they were eligible to operate under the consent in reliance on section 124, and that consent hadn’t been determined. If they were, immediately before the commencement date, eligible to operate under the consent in reliance on section 124, do they not then still have a consent, and why is it referred to as expired in paragraph (b)? If the Minister could take us through that, that would be very useful, and also if he can comment on whether or not there is supposed to be any retrospective element of this legislation.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

I mean, I think people could have a debate about if it’s retrospective or not—and even if it is, that’s not the worst thing in the world. Retrospective legislation that confers a benefit is not constitutionally objectionable—

Ingrid Leary

Labour Party · Taieri

Great! Retirement villages, fairer repayments—brilliant.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Yeah, well, I know your views on that.

Ingrid Leary

Labour Party · Taieri

Thank you. I’m glad you do.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Strong lobbying from Waiheke Island. Reasonable people can have a disagreement around whether or not—I mean, constitutional objection is when there is a penalty imposed retrospectively, which is obviously abhorrent.

But I think it’s relatively straightforward, which is consents that have expired before the commencement date are extended if, before the commencement date, “the holder was eligible to operate under the consent in reliance on section 124;”, which, as the member knows, is when consent has expired but the re-consent has not yet been processed, so they can carry on: “the holder’s application for a new consent had not been determined by the consent authority before the commencement date.” The bill reinstates and extends expired consents where an application for a replacement consent has been made but not yet determined. This doesn’t impose any obligations on consent holders; it simply gives certainty to them during transition to the new resource management system.

Is it retrospective? I mean, it’s forward-looking in the sense that it extends things by a couple of years and helps people out who are in the midst of a re-consenting battle or, at least, the process. Some people would say that’s retrospective. I probably wouldn’t. But, actually, it’s kind of neither here nor there, to be honest.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

I think it is relevant, because this legislation—this short bill—will give people entitlements that they don’t otherwise have, and if they come to rely on it, they are going to want to know what it means. The Hansard on this, with no select committee process, is very important.

“Has the consent expired?” is one question. If they’re relying on section 124—sorry, I spilt my water over before; it’s in front of me over there—is it not expired? Section 124 is the “Exercise of resource consent while applying for [a] new consent”. It “applies when—(a) a resource consent is due to expire;”—it’s not that it’s expired; it’s that it’s due to expire—“and (b) the holder of the consent applies for a new consent for the same activity; and (c) the application is made to the appropriate consent authority; and”—this is very important to my question about whether or not it is expired—(d) is “the application is made at least 6 months before the expiry of the existing consent.”

The point is that if you are in the section 124 process, your consent hasn’t expired. Like, it can’t have expired, because once you’re in, you’re in. Yet the words in this bill are: “a resource consent that expired before the commencement date,”. Then it’s like, well, immediately before, you are in that section 124 process, but it’s only eligible to operate—but presumably you’re not eligible unless you’ve done all those requirements that I just read out and “the holder’s application for a new consent [has] not been determined”.

In fact, is all that is meant here that if you are already in that 124 process—so you’ve done it six months before and you’ve met those other criteria—then your consent won’t expire whilst you’re in that process, or is it supposed to mean something else on top of what happens in section 124, and it is supposed to be retrospective to something that has expired, in that binary sense, or is it that it’s already in the 124 process? I think your words are going to be important here, Minister.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

Well, respectfully, the courts ignore Hansard; whether or not they should is a slightly different matter. The courts focus on what the words say in the statute, and to be honest, given the nonsense talked in this place, that’s probably for the better. Having said that, I’m prepared to mount a strong defence of words mattering or words being important, as Mr Peters would say. I do intend to lay down a marker for how the Government intends things to work in the new system in the first reading, but that’s all for another day. Whether or not the courts pay any attention is a different issue.

To actually address the point, I think it’s important to read new subsection (1)(a) and (b) together, right? So (1)(a) says, “a resource consent that is current on the commencement date [of this bill] but due to expire before the close [is extended]”, right, and (b) says that if you’ve got a resource consent that’s expired before the commencement date, that’s also extended, but only if you’re in the section 124 process.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

So it hasn’t really expired?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Well, you’ve got to read it in the light of the next phrase, which is “expired before the commencement date”. If you’re in the section 124 process, then that gets extended too. It’s a belts and braces approach. It’s either expired or it hasn’t. The point is that as long as you’re in the process or your consent is going to expire during that time frame before the commencement date, you get an extension. It’s a belts and braces approach, but (1)(a) and (b) should be read together.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Thank you. That is helpful. To summarise there, the point is it’s not supposed to be a retrospective bonus for expired consents that aren’t actively in that section 124 process?

Then my next question on this aspect is: if a resource consent is due to expire before 2027—and we’ve talked about and we’ll talk about this once we get to (3), about this two-year extension—does it matter where that expiry date is of the consent in relation to the extension? Can you ever go beyond two years, is my question? Will some be a lot shorter than two years? If you had a consent that was due to expire on 30 December 2027, this is my question: does this bill give you, then, a one-day extension?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Yes.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Yes? Well, thank you. That’s useful.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

It’s a great benefit.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Great benefit.

Well, then I might jump around then a bit and go down to subsection (7). That is that a consent authority must, no later than six months, update a resource consent to which this section applies, record its new expiry date and, if applicable, continue to process and determine the application for the new consent unless it is withdrawn. My question here is around the consultation that has happened with those consent authorities. Presumably, most of the consents and questions here are going to be ones with regional councils or unitaries, because they’re going to relate to water or air and discharges. Most of them won’t be land-use consents.

A number of questions on this: has there been any consultation with councils? What is the requirement on the councils going to be in terms of this administrative task? Has there been any sort of cost-benefit analysis whereby a consent that is due to expire on 1 December 2027 gets a one-day extension? How much resource is going to be required to meet the requirements of subsection (7)?

Then the next question is if he could tell us about the consents that he expects—and there will be further questions on this, particularly in relation to subsection (10), but what are the types of consents that he is expecting will benefit from this extension, given that very few land-use consents have expiry dates unless they’re going to lapse, and what analysis has there been into that, and what sorts of different councils are going to be burdened with these additional administrative tasks?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

Well, I don’t know about administrative tasks; I mean, this is reducing the burden on councils massively, or at least for a while, because they don’t have to process consents any more.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Unless they all end on 31 December.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

But Parliament is legislating for their extension, and so they don’t have to. This will reduce the burden on councils, and I don’t think there’s any doubt about that.

In terms of the types of consents, there’ll be a range, as I think the member herself adverts to in her remarks. In terms of the consultation with councils, there hasn’t been any. This has been done quickly, as the member knows, and so we haven’t engaged with councils on it, but I don’t think anything particularly turns on that, to be honest.

The point about 30 December 2027—I mean, yes, there will be one or two consents which will be in the slightly odd situation of getting a one-day extension, but there will be a bunch that expire quite soon that will no longer have to go through that process. That is the nature of time. It is what it is.

Lawrence Xu-Nan

Green Party · List MP

I want to start by addressing quite a big concern in the departmental disclosure statement (DDS), and that is about some of the Te Tiriti o Waitangi obligations and also external obligations. As is mentioned in the DDS, there are broader implications in terms of “Post-settlement governance entities, Ngā hapū o Ngāti Porou, groups yet to settle their historical Treaty claims, Pou Taiao and Te Tai Kaha”. They’re all being mentioned in here, but I guess the concern is that over here, it says that “Extending consents without engaging Māori raises Treaty implications, as the Crown is generally obliged to consult on proposals affecting Māori interests.” But instead of consulting, it just says that the Minister will “inform”, which is different from “consult”. On top of that, it says that “the Minister intends to inform”—i.e., it hasn’t happened yet—and, on the next page, it says that “Post-settlement governance entities, Ngā hapū o Ngāti Porou, … Pou Taiao and Te Tai Kaha are being informed”.

Are they being informed as we speak, as this bill is going through? I do find that of concern, and I’m hoping that it is of concern for the Minister responsible for RMA Reform, as well, in terms of our general Treaty obligations with our Treaty partner. Not only have they not been consulted; they haven’t even been informed yet, according to the DDS, of what has been happening here. I just wanted to check with the Minister: have they been informed, and if they have, is the Minister intending to consult with them at any stage on the policy proposal of this particular legislation?

The second thing that I wanted to address is the date. Now, this is a question that I held back on asking the Minister about in the earlier clauses, particularly on the commencement date, but the date that is being used here, of 31 December 2027—where did that date come from, and what other considerations did the Minister, in consultation with officials, etc., have for that date?

Now, I understand that we have talked about the fact that this bill is a transitional measure for the other two bills. But if we’re going through the other two bills, both of the other two bills refer to commencement being the day of the Royal assent. I am assuming that the Minister has indicated that the bill will be passed next year, in which case, it will at some point be the day after the day on which it passes next year. In that case, why does the consent need to be extended by two years and not, for example, by a year up until 31 December 2026, if the other two bills are going to be in effect?

Those are my two questions to start off with. They are on our Treaty obligations and also the arbitrariness of the date.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

To deal with the second question first, which I think has been well canvassed, to be honest, for quite a degree of time, it’s a belts and braces approach. The intention of the Government is to legislate for the Planning Bill and the Natural Environment Bill next year, at which point the new consenting regime will kick in and this bill—this Act—and the Resource Management Act (RMA) itself will wither away, but it just gives a bit of extra flex, just in case. That, I think, deals with that. We’ve well canvassed that issue; people are entitled to disagree.

In relation to the member’s point around consultation, I wrote, as Minister responsible for RMA Reform, to post-settlement governance entities and Te Tai Kaha and a range of other groups on Friday, so they’ve had not extensive consultation or engagement but—

Tangi Utikere

Labour Party · Palmerston North

Friday—how many days is that?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Well, you can do the math. I know you’re not very good at it, but you can figure it out. In relation to—

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Would the letters have been received yet? Were they sent by NZ Post?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

They were emailed. We do have emails, you know. I would note—and I suspect members will raise this anyway, because it’s relevant to the point the members are making—at new section 123C(3), inserted by clause 5, the limitation of the extension of water-related consents to a maximum of 35 years. You can’t go beyond the 35 years for water-related consents. As I think some members will know, this was the maximum consent duration for fresh water agreed to by the Crown when the Crown settled the litigation in the lands case, New Zealand Maori Council v Attorney-General, a famous case back in 1987. The bill aligns with that case and aligns with that long-settled matter of policy across successive Governments, so you can’t go beyond a 35-year extension for water-related consents.

New section 123C(4) introduces a specific cut-off for certain historical water consents that were grandfathered into the RMA to avoid unintended long extensions—in other words, past the 35 years mark. It’s the same point. Both those two things have been written in specifically, and that’s been done with post-settlement Government entities and other Māori groups in mind.

Lan Pham

Green Party · List MP

Thank you, Madam Chair, for giving me this call to examine what I believe is quite a substantial aspect of the bill. This is particularly about the implications for council, and this clause makes it really clear, across the many parts of it, that there will be—like the Minister responsible for RMA Reform has said multiple times—less work for councils. With the very, very limited analysis that we have in the departmental disclosure statement—and this is on page 5. It’s talking about the potential costs and benefits—they make it really clear that they haven’t been able to undertake a broad analysis on those.

But my question is, specifically, then—it basically sums it up that this is a continuation of business as usual, and with respect to, particularly, “the potential for any group of persons to suffer a substantial unavoidable loss of income or wealth”, it says that this is not expected. My question is: what are the actual implications for council staff? We know that a lot of council functions are user-pays, and we also know that in the system ahead of us, councils will be under increasing resource strain, because they will be undertaking the implementation of the Resource Management Act’s—the replacement bills that will come into effect. What is expected to happen to council staff jobs, particularly in the consent and compliance space, with the enaction of this?

Now, the Minister, I think, in his earlier comment, mentioned, “Oh, they’re expecting, like, a few thousand.” I’d like clarification of what the number was that the Minister says about how many consents they’re actually—if they have any take on the magnitude of this, because if it is a great amount, then it could actually have significant impacts on those council staff and result in potential joblessness, presumably, for them. I’d really like to hear whether that has been considered, and to what magnitude.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

There is expected to be a light implementation requirement. Councils just simply have to update their records. Parliament is, essentially, legislating extensions for these consents. Councils have to update their records. That’s not burdensome. It probably takes longer than five minutes because we don’t have e-plans and digital records, but it shouldn’t, theoretically, take that much longer.

In relation to the member’s other question around how many consents, we’ve canvassed this at least two or three times now. We don’t know exactly, but we think, roughly, between maybe 2,000 and 2,500—about that many.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Thank you, Madam Chair, and thank you to the Minister for taking us through some of the logic in new subsections 123C(3) and (4). I was going to ask about new subsection (4) and the bit right at the end of (4), which is “granted under this Act”, but it does seem clear that this is the Resource Management Act that that applies to.

Looking at new subsection (5), then: “Any conditions applying to a resource consent … before it expired … continue to apply unless a change to a condition is required as a consequence of extending the consent under this section.” Can the Minister explain what type of change to a condition might be required as a consequence of extending the consent under the section? Is he thinking it’s just about timing—temporal factors—or are there other factors, as well? For instance, if you had a consent that was trying to reduce, say, nitrates into the river by a certain time and you got it extended, do you think there’d be some circumstance where you would—I’m just going to ask you another question, too.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

OK.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Thank you—[Knocks microphone] Oh, sorry microphone. Thank you in anticipation of you answering that one.

But, also, related to this point is whether or not those conditions on that consent that are getting the two-year extension—can they be reviewed? Do the normal review provisions apply? I’m seeing a nod there, so I’ll let you answer.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

I’m advised it’s really just to make clear that it doesn’t change any consent conditions; it’s just for clarity. It’s to make clear. If you’re talking about new section 123C(5), consent conditions continue to apply, and yes, there can be reviews. It is just a time frame extension for a couple of years. Everything else carries on.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Are there any examples, though? It does say, “unless a change to a condition is required as a consequence of extending [that] consent under this section.” Has he got any examples of what that might apply to, other than a temporal requirement in a consent condition?

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

Lan Pham—you can ask your question in the meantime while the Minister—

Lan Pham

Green Party · List MP

Thank you. Mine is an extension of just that, because it implies that there is some sort of assessment or review, whereas this is talking about blanket extensions given set criteria, so I’m really keen to hear the Minister expand specifically on that.

Damien O'Connor

Labour Party · List MP

Thank you, Madam Chair. Look, something’s occurred to me, because I know that members of the coalition Government have indicated—and I haven’t seen the legislation; my colleagues may have read through it. In the two substantive pieces of legislation that we’re about to see, the implication is that if there is any imposition on property rights, then there will be some access to compensation.

My question in relation to this is that if we, indeed, are having an extension, and it’s for two years, on consents that were processed and approved, fees paid for, and there may have been some payment for that right—so it’s a property right; we accept that—then the extension of that automatically may incur a liability; that is, that someone gets a free property right. The Minister responsible for RMA Reform said that it’s a certainty. If we’re going to see the principles of compensation as applied in the legislation that we’re about to see, then should these people who have applied and have probably paid some money to get that consent extended—if it’s automatic, then is there going to be a fee automatically paid for the extension of a property right?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

The answer is no, although good question, and also there will be no refunds for people that are in the midst of consent processing, either. This is just Parliament taking the problem away for everyone. No compensation and no refunds.

Damien O'Connor

Labour Party · List MP

I mean, property rights accrue to not just a private landowner; property rights accrue to taxpayers, to the Crown, to iwi, and we may be forgoing property rights, and so what about us getting compensation? The Minister responsible for RMA Reform chortles away there, but I’d suggest to him that very soon after the implementation of his new Resource Management Act regime, the country will be tied up in huge litigation over whose property rights are paramount and who should be paid compensation. If we are to establish property rights in the hands of private individuals, then we must assess property rights across the collective, across the Crown, across iwi, and where’s that going to end up?

The Minister smiles. I’m glad that I’ve kind of tickled his fancy, I really am, because if he can’t see this coming down the track, then he should wake up. It’s an inevitable outcome of what he will be setting up. But for this piece of legislation here, the automatic rollover, did he—and he’s indicated no. Well, why not consider compensation to those who are passing on the additional property rights as a way of a reasonable commercial deal?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

I refer the member to section 122 of the Resource Management Act (RMA): consents are not a property right—although sometimes people think they should be. I think the reason I was sort of chortling away and smiling is that, I mean, the member’s right and makes good points around—and we are going to have a debate in the next little while around the appropriate role of Government in regulating for the national good and the public good in the commons and on private property. We live in a mixed economy, and the Government’s view is that we have got the balance wrong when it comes to the ability of councils and Government to impose significant restrictions on private property for the public good, and that there needs to be a greater delineation between the public and the private realms. Now, that’s quite a big debate. It actually happened when the RMA 1991 was passed, and we’re going to have the same debate again.

I am not someone who thinks, for example, that you can’t have zoning. I mean, there’s a school of thought, in the hardcore anarcho-libertarian world, which suggests that zoning is a violation of property. I mean, sort of by definition, it’s true. I live in a residential zone; I can’t set up an industrial effluent discharge factory. That’s outrageous on one level. Clearly, there needs to be zoning. There’s a debate around the extent of it and the rules and how clear it is and the consistency, and we’re going to make some changes in that direction, but zoning is not offensive as a concept. Actually, it’s a legitimate planning role in order to separate out incompatible land uses so that you don’t rely on the tort of nuisance, which would be completely inefficient from a property rights point of view. It’s got its place, but it would be inefficient, so that’s partly why we have planning. I’m not an extremist like that.

On the other hand, when councils or Governments can turn around and say, “Hey, by the way, you own that piece of land; 90 percent of it’s now a significant natural area.”, such that you can’t do anything with that land, that has an impact on your land. If I own a house and the Government turns around, or the council turns around, and says, “We’ve decided that it’s a heritage house.”, and I can’t add a second storey or subdivide or paint it a different colour, that has an impact. I think most people reasonably understand that, and the debate is in the middle rather than on the extremes. The debate in the middle is around what the appropriate kind of regulatory response to that is. We’re proposing a series of changes that force harder decisions around those choices. Well, I’m happy to have a debate about it, and no doubt we will. It’s not the focus of this, but, anyway, I just thought I’d take that opportunity to lay it out of it. I’m looking forward to the actual debate in due course.

Damien O'Connor

Labour Party · List MP

Madam Chair.

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

Is this a subsequent question?

Damien O'Connor

Labour Party · List MP

It is a subsequent question, absolutely, because I—

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

Related to here or the upcoming legislation?

Damien O'Connor

Labour Party · List MP

Yes, it does go to this, because it goes to the heart of the automatic transfer of rights, which you’re talking about, because these consents are being extended. These consents are being extended with no compensation, the Minister has said, and the question is a legitimate one for us, given there’s no select committee process. In select committee, I’m sure this would be kicked around. There’s no select committee process, and it’s the only opportunity we have to quiz the Minister, and it’s a legitimate one: are there precedents being set here? That is that the compensation is only going to be one way under the Resource Management Act (RMA), and I think that is totally unjust.

The Minister refers to property rights of the commons versus private, except that we’ve started to touch on what is a critical issue. The Minister may talk about the middle, but his coalition partner in ACT talks about the extreme; that is, that private property rights trump everything else—trump being the right word. I am concerned that what we’re doing here by automatically extending a consent, and people thought it was “just to offer certainty”, is setting the precedent for free property right extension for private property owners with no payment of compensation—call it what you like—for the commons or for the taxpayer.

That’s why I asked the Minister, because while I respect his view that we’re trying to work in the middle, all the rhetoric that we hear around the RMA reforms is at the extreme end of property rights and upholding them. The Minister refers to one of a house. There are always restrictions on what you can do in and out and around your house, always. There will be, we hope, because to have completely laissez-faire, and a private property owner able to do whatever he or she or they want, is outrageous, because we live in a community. We live in a society, and we have to have some guidelines, and the Minister accepts that. The question here is: are we setting a precedent here that automatically extends property rights for private landowners—that is, the person who’s got a consent—but doesn’t require any payment or compensation or consideration for that?

I’m no lawyer, but I know that deep in the heart of law and law journals and learnings, there are some key principles there. I’ll leave that question with the Minister, and maybe he’d like to come back and answer it.

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

I’m going to call Lan Pham. We’re seriously running out of clauses on this part, but before, when the Minister was taking advice, Lan Pham, you asked a question about assessment or review, and I don’t know that we actually got to the point where the Minister heard it and was able to answer. If you want to, perhaps, repeat that question as part of what you’re going to ask.

Lan Pham

Green Party · List MP

Sure.

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

I think you were asking whether there was going to be an assessment or review while this process was happening.

Lan Pham

Green Party · List MP

Yeah. Was there assessment? I’m just trying to find the clause that I followed up Rachel Brooking on—

Members

Five.

Lan Pham

Green Party · List MP

Yes, it is clause 5.

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

The Minister’s actually said he can deal with it.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

Well, I mean, this point was raised by Ms Pham and also Rachel Brooking. I’m advised it’s a belts and braces approach, just to make sure that conditions applying to resource consent continue before it expired and they continue to apply unless there’s a change applied as a consequence of extended resource consent. We don’t know if that would be the case, necessarily. I think the member asked for examples. We don’t know of any examples, but it’s just a belts and braces approach to say that if there needs to be a change in conditions as a result of the two-year extension—frankly, I think it’s unlikely, but if there was—there’s the ability for that to happen, and that’s all there is to it, really.

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

Arena Williams, you’ve been seeking a call for a little while, so we’ll take one from you, thank you.

Arena Williams

Labour Party · Manurewa

Thank you, Madam Chair. I have some specific questions for the Minister around new section 123C(1)(b), and I was waiting for the opportunity to ask him, because it is specifically about Auckland and different subject matter to what my colleagues have dealt with. I flagged for the Minister, in the earlier stages—I think it was the clause 1 debate—that I’d be asking about Plan Change (PC) 78 and PC 120, so I’ll turn to that now.

The question I have for the Minister is—he’s helpfully explained the word “expired” here, so I want to clarify with him what he means about consents which had inoperative effect before PC 120 came into effect, which followed his amendments to the Resource Management Act previously passed in this House in this year. Auckland Council responded to that by introducing PC 120 from 3 November 2025.

It will help, Madam Chair, if you’ll allow me to set out an example for the Minister here. What I’m asking about is those developers—in many cases, we’re talking about small developers—who were building three-storey townhouses and were relying on the medium density residential standards (MDRS), because the underlying zone in Auckland allowed for two-storey-high developments. They had a resource consent, in those cases, which didn’t cover permitted activities, because that was permitted by the MDRS, but they would have had consent for other things, like the civil works. Then, they would have either had a building consent or been in the process of having a building consent. When the MDRS became inoperative, and when PC 120 then applied, from 3 November, those developers were, effectively, in the situation where they no longer were able to develop their land. I’m asking him very straight whether new section 123C(1)(b) fixes the problem for those developers?

Given that he’s used the word “expired”, you’d have to read that up. He might improve the situation by talking about resource consents that were operative before the commencement date. That would be a simple change that would make sure that the situation that I’m talking about would clean that up. There’s a real need here for natural justice, especially because in that situation, there were developers who were doing everything right and progressing their developments under the rules as they applied then and were hearing policy intentions from political parties of both colours that the intention was to continue with intensification, so those three-storey townhouses were not only encouraged at the time they were developing them but were also something that they probably should have been able to rely on being allowed for in the future. That is, in fact, the case with PC 120, but they can’t rely on PC 120. I think the Minister gets the gist. I have some other questions about the natural justice questions.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

I’m very familiar with that issue. It’s not for me to give legal advice. It’s not the intention of this bill, in the clause the member refers to, to assist. I am familiar with the examples that the member raises, and it would be fair to say that there is dialogue between the Government and council.

Arena Williams

Labour Party · Manurewa

But you can fix it now.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Well, it’s slightly more complicated than that, because these were consents that had, largely, permitted activities. I’m getting away from the bill now, but they had permitted activity standards, which—because of the immediate withdrawal of Plan Change 78 and the replacement by Plan Change 120, they no longer have any form of consent. The 124 carry-over doesn’t apply, so they sort of fall within this lacuna, which is, frankly, pretty frustrating for everyone. I think the member is nodding. I can talk to her offline about it, but there is dialogue between council and the Government in relation to that issue. It’s not the intention of this section to help that particular situation.

Grant McCallum

National Party · Northland

I move, That debate on this question now close.

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

I’m going to take a call from Tangi Utikere, but I am looking for new clauses now, because I think we have pretty much canvassed the main part of this and there’s very little left in this piece.

Tangi Utikere

Labour Party · Palmerston North

Kia ora, thank you, Madam Chair.

Lawrence Xu-Nan

Green Party · List MP

Point of order, Madam Chair. I actually just want to seek your guidance on something, and this is something I’ve been observing. Madam Chair, you were the Chair that was in the seat at the stage when we were going through the committee stage for the Companies (Address Information) Amendment Act, which was a member’s bill by the Hon Dr Deborah Russell. That was a bill that went through select committee stage and it was a member’s bill and it was four pages long, and in those processes, the Chair has allowed for a four-hour debate on those bills. I just want to seek the—

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

Yeah, no, I think where you’re conflating the two issues is that—that was a member’s bill, and you will have observed in your time in the House, because you’re very perceptive, that members’ day bills run quite differently. Because of the dynamics of the House and the numbers on each side of the House, it almost goes in reverse. In this situation, what I’m actually wanting to do is to get the best out of each clause. It’s a very specific bill that’s setting a time frame. The questions have been relevant, but I think we’re getting to the end of new questions.

Tangi Utikere

Labour Party · Palmerston North

Thank you, Madam Chair, it’s a pleasure to put some questions to the Minister responsible for RMA Reform on what is the most significant part of this bill.

Earlier in a contribution, the Minister talked about how the courts would perhaps not be looking at the Hansard but would be more interested in what’s actually contained in the bill. There are a couple of questions around this. The first one, for me, is whether or not the Minister has looked at a shorter period of time. For example, what’s proposed currently is that it would be a two-year period through to 31 December, but the Minister hasn’t indicated in committee as to why a shorter period of time, perhaps, would not be more appropriate.

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

I wasn’t in the Chair, but I believe that may have been traversed during the commencement clause.

Tangi Utikere

Labour Party · Palmerston North

The commencement clause.

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

Yes.

Tangi Utikere

Labour Party · Palmerston North

OK, thank you. But not related—it might have been in the commencement clause, but not in relation to this particular clause—

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

But it has been discussed.

Tangi Utikere

Labour Party · Palmerston North

Clause 5 outlines the particular dates that things come into effect. The question I have for the Minister is—it’s curious, when one looks at new section 123C(1)(a), the language that is used throughout this clause when it comes to the date is actually around “before the close of 31 December 2027:”, and then further down, that’s repeated, I think, at least on two other occasions, and then there is “expires on the close of 1 October 2026” in subsection (4). The curious nature of that, of course, is that often when we talk about the close of something, it could be the close of business. One assumes that it is midnight here. Why does it not just say 1 January 2028? I mean, effectively, it’s the same aspect, right? I mean, consistency with other legislation in terms of when a particular date comes into effect—that is my first question.

My other question is around new section 123C(8), and this relies on the issues that have been raised previously in contributions, and certainly in the second reading and first reading, around the lack of information that is available. The Minister has talked about thousands of consents being impacted in this particular space, but when we look at subsection (8), this is talking about the extant waste-water consents which relate to constructing or operating a waste-water network. There are not huge numbers of those. When that’s broken down, this is, effectively, a caveat that doesn’t apply—it’s an exemption, basically—but it applies in two particular quarters or two areas: the first is section 139C, and the second one is 139D; the “D” one is about the Minister making an extension.

My question for the Minister is: does he have any information on the numbers of consents that fall into this particular provision? It’s not about, you know, there are thousands out there; I accept the Minister has said that we don’t have the information specifically in front of us. But when we are talking about, effectively, carving out the applicability to certain types of consents, when it comes to extant waste-water consents that have already been extended either by application or, indeed, by the Minister, I think it is still important to understand how many we are talking about in that particular space.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

Good questions from the member. In relation to new section 123C(4), as I talked to Ms Brooking about around this, it introduces a specific cut-off with certain historic water consents that were grandfathered into the Resource Management Act, hence the 1 October 2026 time frame. Subsection (8) is important. Waste-water consents were extended to allow for new waste-water standards to now, which have now been introduced. They are extended beyond 31 December 2027 to August 2028, as I think the member knows. The purpose of subsection (8) is to avoid overriding that, so we’re not shortening their extension via this bill.

Just for clarity, the waste-water consents have already been extended by the Local Government (Water Services) (Repeals and Amendments) Act 2025. That’s already happened through to August 2028, and everyone’s—well, there seems to be broad agreement that that’s OK. That’s the law, anyway. It is what it is. The purpose of new section 123C(8) is to avoid overriding recently legislated arrangements for waste-water network consents. The bill excludes waste-water consents from the general consent transition provision. For maximum clarity: waste water, August 2028; everything else, two years through to December 2027. But it’s to avoid overriding that.

Todd Stephenson

ACT Party · List MP

Whip

I move, That debate on this question now close.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That debate on this question now close.

Ayes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Noes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Motion agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

The question is that Dr Lawrence Xu-Nan’s tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C, replacing “31 December 2027” with “31 December 2026” in all instances be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

Arena Williams’ tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C, replacing “31 December 2027” with “1 December 2026 at 5 p.m.” in all instances is ruled out of order as not being in the correct form of legislation.

The question is that Mariameno Kapa-Kingi’s tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C, inserting new subsection (1A) be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

The question is that Mariameno Kapa-Kingi’s tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C, replacing subsection (2) be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

Mariameno Kapa-Kingi’s tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C(2), amending paragraph (a) is ruled out of order as not being in the correct form of legislation.

The question is that Lan Pham’s tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C, inserting new subsection (2)(a) be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

The question is that Lan Pham’s tabled amendment to clause 5, deleting section 123C(3) be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

The question is that Arena Williams’ tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C(3)(a) be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

The question is that the Hon Rachel Brooking’s tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C(3)(a) be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

The question is that the Hon Rachel Brooking’s tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C(3)(b), to replace “35” with “30” be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

The question is that Dr Lawrence Xu-Nan’s tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C(3)(b), to replace “35 years” with “20 years” be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

The question is that Arena Williams’ tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C(3)(b), replacing “35 years” with “12 years with a right to renewal of another 12 years” be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

The question is that Arena Williams’ remaining tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C(3)(b) be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

The Hon Rachel Brooking’s remaining tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C(3)(b) is ruled out of order as not being in the correct form of legislation.

The question is that Lan Pham’s tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C, inserting new subsection (3A) be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

The question is that Arena Williams’ tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C, inserting new subsection (3A) be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

The question is that Dr Lawrence Xu-Nan’s tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C(4), replacing “1 October 2026” with “1 September 2026” be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

The question is that Mariameno Kapa-Kingi’s tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C, inserting new subsection (5A) be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

The question is that Dr Lawrence Xu-Nan’s tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C(6) be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

The question is that Arena Williams’ tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C(6) be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

The question is that Arena Williams’ tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C(7), replacing “6” with “9” be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

The question is that Arena Williams’ tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C(7), replacing “6” with “8” be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

Dr Lawrence Xu-Nan’s tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C(7) is ruled out of order as being the same in substance as a previous amendment.

The question is that Arena Williams’ tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C(7), replacing “6” with “12” be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

The question is that Mariameno Kapa-Kingi’s tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C, inserting new subsection (7A) be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

The question is that Arena Williams’ tabled amendment to clause 5, deleting 123C(8) be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

Dr Lawrence Xu-Nan’s tabled amendment to clause 5, deleting section 123C(8), is ruled out of order as being the same in substance as previous amendment.

The question is that Dr Lawrence Xu-Nan’s tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C(9) be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

Noes 68

PartyCount
Ayes55
New Zealand Labour34
Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand15
Te Pāti Māori4
Named members
Ferris, Kapa-Kingi
2
Noes68
New Zealand National49
ACT New Zealand11
New Zealand First8

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

The question is that Arena Williams’ tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C(9) be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

The question is that Dr Lawrence Xu-Nan’s tabled amendment to clause 5, section 123C(10) be agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.

Ayes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Noes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Amendment not agreed to.

Party vote

A party vote was called for on the question, That clause 5 be agreed to.

Ayes 68

New Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.

Noes 55

New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15;Te Pāti Māori 4; Ferris; Kapa-Kingi.

Clause 5 agreed to.

Bill to be reported without amendment.

House resumed.

Vote: Bills

Barbara Kuriger

Chairperson

Mr Speaker, the committee has considered the Resource Management (Duration of Consents) Amendment Bill and reports it without amendment. I move, That the report be adopted.

Motion agreed to.

Report adopted.

Greg O'Connor

Assistant Speaker

This bill is set down for third reading immediately.

Third Reading

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

I move, That the Resource Management (Duration of Consents) Amendment Bill be now read a third time.

The issues have been well canvassed in the first and second readings and the committee of the whole House, and I want to thank members of the Opposition for their good engagement during the committee of the whole House stage. I think we had a good, robust interrogation of the various clauses—including the first, and I’m sure not the last, time we had a debate over what the word “is” means from Dr Lawrence Xu-Nan. He’s fast gaining a reputation as the master of—oh, here he is—niche questioning. Some would call it esoteric, others would call it pointless, but reasonable people can disagree on all of these issues, and, anyway, we enjoy it.

The intention of this bill has been well canvassed. It’s a short bill, six clauses only—five, maybe—to provide certainty as we go through that consent transition process laid out in the Planning Bill and the Natural Environment Bill, which were laid on the floor of the House today. They will get a first reading next week, and we will have a chance to have debate about those next week and send them to select committee. In the interim, it is clear that the Parliament needs to send a clear signal to people with that uncertainty around what happens to their consents as we approach the onset of the new planning system, so the consent extensions are through to 31 December 2027. That’s a belts and braces approach—a bit of a backstop. The new regime will take effect at some point mid - next year, which will kick into the whole regime.

I think the issues with that have been well canvassed, but it’s a really short and sharp bill. It is a temporary bill; it is a temporary transition measure. I think it will be widely welcomed by many people around New Zealand.

Grant McCallum

National Party · Northland

Absolutely.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Absolutely, says Grant McCallum; farming communities, says Grant McCallum. The others as well. I commend the bill to the House.

Barbara Kuriger

Deputy Speaker

The question is that the motion be agreed to.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Thank you, Madam Speaker. I want to remind everybody who’s watching that this bill was introduced today—Tuesday—in the afternoon, and we did not see any of the accompanying documents until the Minister stood up and started speaking. We’re now coming to the third reading, and tomorrow morning—

Barbara Kuriger

Deputy Speaker

Which will still be today.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

—which will still be today in parliamentary time. You’re right—you’re right, Madam Speaker. But we will still be on this bill, and then it will be sent off for Royal assent. This is a terrible way to make law, and that is why Labour has been opposing this bill. It was not signalled to us at all. To give the Minister some credit, he has engaged on the other two pieces of legislation, but not this. This came as a total surprise today, and here we are, already on the third reading.

There’s just been no analysis with this bill, so we do not know what the consequences of it will be. We’ve heard the Minister say, “Well, it’s a Christmas present to people.” We’ve heard other members say, “This is going to be great for farmers.”—but why is it going to be great for those people, and what are the implications for other resource users? Most resource consents that have an expiry date on them are for water takes and discharges—that is, if there is some pollution of a waterway or if water is being taken, it could be taken for all sorts of wonderful reasons. But if you take water, then that will often have an implication for other users of that resource, because there is not all the water that everybody wants in all of the places, and so different consents will go for different periods of time and they will impact on other people’s uses, as well. They might be future users. It might be a new farmer who wants to get a consent to do something with water and they might not be able to, as a consequence of somebody else having their consent go for another two years without having to apply for it. It might be that the water continues to be polluted when it wouldn’t have been otherwise.

There’s a whole lot of “mights” here—and this is my point. I don’t know what the consequences of this bill will be, because we were presented with zero analysis. All that we heard was that there would be some thousands of consents affected. That was it. Not the types of consents, not the implications on other consents—none of that analysis was there. We heard from other speakers around this side of the House, as well, about how communities very much care about waterways and how they’re relevant to Treaty settlements. They’re very important to iwi; they’re mahinga kai areas. If someone continues to have a consent that is polluting or is taking water, that might have—when I say it “might”, again—an impact on the amount of tuna in the river. It might not—I don’t know, because nobody has told us.

This legislation, whilst the Minister can wave it about and say, “Well, it’s only five clauses; it doesn’t really matter.”, it does matter. We don’t know how much it matters, though, and had we been able to take this to a select committee, I could have asked those questions. I could have asked those questions of officials: “What are the implications of this? Where is your analysis on who is going to be impacted by these changes?”. But I’ve not had the opportunity to do so. It seems that it’s just for some sort of political joking around about the importance of Christmas, which I just really think undermines our parliamentary democracy and is not a reason for using all-stages urgency.

Now, I say whenever we do these bills under all-stages urgency—when there is no emergency, but even if there was an emergency, I would still say it—there needs to be a post-enactment review of what we’re doing here today. But, yet again, we have another piece of legislation that has no postenactment review. If there was a compelling argument for why this Christmas gift of certainty was needed, then at least we could come back in the new year and ask those questions of officials: “Well, how many people is that going to affect?” That would be difficult, of course, to do that. We would do that, but it would be very unlikely that this Government would then want to undermine those rights that they’d just given. I do acknowledge that, but I think it goes to the wider point that we should not be passing legislation in this way.

We should have had time to ask the select committee what it meant—who will be affected by it. We heard the Minister say, “Oh, there’s been good debate.” We’ve heard very little from the Government side in their contributions—maybe we will hear some more from them in the third reading—because almost every contribution, except from the Ministers, has been about farmers and how this is going to help farmers.

Suze Redmayne

National Party · Rangitīkei

The engine room of the economy.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

Oh, and I’m hearing it’s the “engine room of the economy”. Well, farmers often have arguments with other farmers about these resources. But, also, not all of these consents relate to farmers. There are giant other parts of our economy that this bill relates to, and they might be totally benign users; there might be very good things that we all want to continue on with for two years—but we don’t know, because there has been no analysis. That is very poor, and it’s incredibly annoying to just listen to the people across there go on about how it’s all going to be great for farmers, without turning their minds to what this piece of legislation might mean and who might be affected by it. I have not heard one speech address that issue, so I’m very hopeful that the future third reading speeches will address that.

Now, another way to approach this bill could have been “OK, we want to give people some certainty as a new regime is coming, but we know that some consents are more proportionally.”—and the Minister is talking about proportionality in his new legislation a lot. You might say, “Well, we know that some consents have much bigger environmental impacts than other consents.” If you’ve got a little take of water for your household, or you have to feed your cats or something, then you might not need very much water, but if you are taking for a massive hydro scheme, then that is going to have—or could have; depends how long the consent has been around for—some very big environmental effects, and those are the effects that I’m concerned about here. If the Minister wanted to do this, there could be legislation that said, “We are going to extend consents that are below some threshold.”

Of course, that would require some thought to work out what the threshold is, and to work out what that threshold is, you’d have to be more explicit in the thinking and the analysis of the type of consents that are affected by this piece of legislation. Of course, that hasn’t happened. But that would be a way of saying, “No, no, we realise that a small family farmer who’s got some consents that may not trouble the river that much.” That might be entirely appropriate for them to have a two-year extension in this, whereas a very large project that perhaps the consent conditions were made a long time ago—perhaps it’s one of those consents that was made 25 years ago, when conditions were of quite a different form than they are now. With that resource consent, it might not be appropriate that those conditions remain for another two years now.

Simon Court

ACT Party · List MP

It’s going to be fine for two years.

Rachel Brooking

Labour Party · Dunedin

We don’t know it’s going to be fine, Mr Court. That is the problem.

Barbara Kuriger

Deputy Speaker

This debate is interrupted and is set down for resumption tomorrow morning. The House is suspended until 9 a.m. tomorrow.

Debate interrupted.

Sitting suspended from 9.59 p.m. to 9 a.m. (Wednesday)

TUESDAY, 9 DECEMBER 2025

(continued on Wednesday, 10 December 2025)

Bills

Resource Management (Duration of Consents) Amendment Bill

Third Reading

Vote: Bills

Arms Bill

First Reading

Carl Bates

National Party · Whanganui

Thank you, Madam Speaker. This bill is designed to ensure that we promote the safe possession and use of arms, and there’s a couple of things within the bill that I thought I would highlight as part of that objective. The first is the clarification of the 60 offences down into eight offences. I think that that really ensures that we’re clear that there are offences for doing things wrong, but we make them easy to understand. Secondly, there is the independence of the Firearms Licencing Review Committee. Therefore, I commend the bill to the House.

Fast-track Approvals Amendment Bill

Second Reading

Vote: Bills

Oral Questions

Questions to Ministers

Question No. 1—Finance

1. Finance

NANCY LU

National Party

to the Minister of Finance

What recent reports has she seen on the economy?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister of Finance

A fortnight ago, the Reserve Bank released its latest Monetary Policy Statement. This contained the bank’s decision to reduce the official cash rate (OCR) to 2.25 percent, making it the ninth OCR reduction since August last year. The Reserve Bank’s forward track for the OCR indicated that this was likely to be the last reduction; certainly, that is how markets are now appearing to see it, but monetary stimulus will continue to flow through the economy as more and more homeowners roll off fixed-term mortgages and refix at lower rates, particularly if they’re prepared to shop around and hold their banks to account for giving them the lowest rate possible.

Nancy Lu

What did the Reserve Bank say about the performance of the economy this year?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister of Finance

The Reserve Bank points out that New Zealand’s economic recovery was disrupted in the June quarter as greater uncertainty, particularly around tariffs, led to increased precautionary behaviour by households and businesses, dampening consumption and investment. Since then, the indicators of economic activity have improved, and the Reserve Bank is expecting the economy to recover in the September and December quarters of this year. Its forecast is for GDP growth of 0.4 percent in the September quarter just gone, and we’ll see what that number really is next Thursday when Stats NZ release the latest figures.

Nancy Lu

What did the Reserve Bank say about the outlook for the economy next year?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister of Finance

The Reserve Bank’s outlook for 2026 is very positive. Its forecasts support the widespread consensus that the economy is strengthening. The bank expects growth to build next year, and this is driven by the stimulus from lower interest rates continuing to transmit to higher domestic demand and as the effects of global economic uncertainty wane. As the economy picks up, unemployment falls. The Reserve Bank is expecting unemployment to start falling early in the first half of the year and to steadily drop after that. This is not me expecting higher growth and lower unemployment; this is the independent Reserve Bank.

Nancy Lu

What did the Reserve Bank say about the outlook for inflation?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister of Finance

The Reserve Bank expects annual Consumers Price Index inflation to return to near the 2 percent target midpoint by the middle of 2026. It says that inflation for food, household energy, and local rates is currently well above historical averages, which is why headline inflation is currently at the top of the 1 to 3 percent target range. However, it expects these particular pressures to reduce in the near future, alongside a continued broad-based easing in underlying inflation. This is obviously good news for Kiwi households, and while current inflation pressures are higher than most people would like, it is a far cry from inflation of 7.3 percent under the previous Government.

Question No. 2—Prime Minister

2. Prime Minister

Chris Hipkins

Labour Party · Remutaka

Leader of the Opposition

to the Prime Minister

Does he stand by all his Government’s statements and actions?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Yes.

Chris Hipkins

Labour Party · Remutaka

Does he agree with Nicola Willis that his Government has “delivered more social homes in our first two years in office than the last Government did in three.”, and, if so, how is the 197 homes his Government has actually funded and built greater than the 7,228 additional homes that the previous Government built over three years?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

In answer to the first leg of the question, yes.

Chris Hipkins

Labour Party · Remutaka

How is 197 a bigger number than 7,228, or is his ability to count even worse than Chris Bishop’s?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

We have built 7,000 homes in the last two years.

Chris Hipkins

Labour Party · Remutaka

How can he claim that they’ve built nearly 7,000 additional houses under his Government when all but 197 of those were already funded and already under way when he became the Prime Minister, and his Government has, in fact, cut funding for thousands of additional house builds that could have been under way, with some even finished by now?

David Seymour

ACT Party · Epsom

Point of order. Mr Speaker, I seek your guidance: if that question can stand with reference to a previous Government, does that mean answers can make similar references?

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

No. I think the reference in any of these things is the answers given by Ministers, which did reference that previous Government, so that brings it immediately into context. But thank you for your inquiry.

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

No disrespect, but I won’t take lectures from that member on social or community housing because he came to Government and he had a fourfold increase—a fourfold increase—in people on the social housing wait-list; and, already, in two years, this Government is taking 5,000 to 6,000 people off the social housing wait-list, because, actually, what matters is outcomes, getting things done, getting people into houses. That’s what we’re doing.

Chris Hipkins

Labour Party · Remutaka

Why won’t he take lectures from a Government that delivered 14,000 additional social homes to his Government’s 197, and doesn’t that say everything about his Government’s priorities: all talk, no action?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Well, let’s talk the record, shall we? Why don’t we do that? Because that would be fun. What we’ve got is a previous Government that ran up housing and made housing so unaffordable. House prices went up 30 percent in one single year. Rents went up $180 per week. You inherited a wait-list of 6,000, you turned it into 24,000, and we’ve already taken it down by 5,000 in two years. You had 3,200 people in households sitting in motel accommodation, and we’ve put people into warm, dry houses. I’d stack our record on housing any day of the week. [Interruption]

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

That’s enough—that’s enough, from both sides. The noise level for that answer was ridiculous. The Prime Minister doesn’t need the assistance of his backbench or fellow Ministers to answer questions.

Chris Hipkins

Labour Party · Remutaka

How many of the 3,000 additional social houses across Auckland that Nicola Willis signed a pledge to deliver will be delivered by the next election, given that, so far, they’ve only delivered 197 across the entire country. Or was that pledge, like all of the pledges that they made pre-election, a promise they never intended to keep?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Well, if the member would like to put the question in writing, I’m sure we can get a detailed answer.

Megan Woods

Labour Party · Wigram

No, no—you don’t know the answer. Sit down. Answer the question or sit down.

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

But the big point I want to highlight here, and this is the difference between Labour and our side of the Government: house prices went up 30 percent in a year, rents went up $180 a week, and you had a quadrupling of the social housing wait-list.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Hold on—hold on. There needs to be a lot more restraint from that side of the House. I know that one member there is very eager to end her week and has made a request that I assist her in doing so, but I’m not impressed by the efforts that are currently being made.

Chris Hipkins

Labour Party · Remutaka

When he begins an answer with “What I would say to you is:”, will he ever follow that with an actual answer to the question that’s being asked?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

What I’ll follow it up with is [Interruption]—what I’ll follow it up with is: outcomes, outcomes, outcomes. I mean, it’s unbelievable to me that a Labour Party supposedly caring about housing as a core equity did it so badly. You managed it so badly; you made it more unaffordable for people to get into a house. You made rents go up $180 a week. You put a fourfold increase in people on the social housing wait-list. Your record is abysmal; you should be ashamed of it.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

The Hon Chris Bishop, when the House is giving you the respect of asking a question in silence, go ahead.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Can the Prime Minister confirm that, between 2018 and 2021, the then Government was very fond of claiming houses were built under that Government that were, indeed, funded between the 2014 and 2017 period?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Well, thank you, the member, for his question, but what’s important is actually getting houses built, getting people into houses, and making sure housing is more affordable. I want to say a big thank you to that Minister, because he’s done a very good job in two short years compared to six years under Labour, where it was a debacle.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

I’ll tell you what: the whole week could end early if I were to take drastic steps, pleaded on her behalf by a member on the front bench of the Labour Party, for the entire party.

Chris Hipkins

Labour Party · Remutaka

Are you keeping a list?

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

It’s all on the naughty side, believe me.

Question No. 3—RMA Reform

3. RMA Reform

Grant McCallum

National Party · Northland

to the Minister responsible for RMA Reform

What feedback has he seen on the Government’s new proposed planning system?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

Yesterday, the Government announced its new planning system to make it easier to build the homes and infrastructure New Zealand needs, give farmers and growers the freedom to get on with producing world-class food and fibre, and strengthen our primary sector. Some of the responses to the reforms have been quite remarkable. Business New Zealand said that they were “transformational and should result in fewer consents”. It’s critical that this new system is enduring and has broad support. There are clearly areas of disagreement between the Opposition and the Government. However, it is pleasing to see some generally positive remarks coming from the Leader of the Opposition, and I’m sure that as we get into the debate, there will potentially be more remarks like that.

Grant McCallum

National Party · Northland

What feedback has he seen from developers and businesses?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

Our development community and our business community has been tied down in red tape for so long. The Employers and Manufacturers Association said that the proposed reforms “will provide impetus to economic, business and infrastructure development”, and Civil Contractors lauded the approach as “clear, sensible, and pragmatic.” Infrastructure New Zealand said that the proposals “will provide certainty and drive infrastructure development.” The Property Council said, “A clearer, more consistent planning framework means more land uses will no longer require consent, saving time [and] reducing cost,”. It’s great to see these positive remarks.

Grant McCallum

National Party · Northland

What feedback has he seen from the primary sector?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

A key theme of the reforms announced yesterday is to make sure that farmers and growers spend less time burdened with paperwork and more time actually farming. Federated Farmers called this “a huge win for common sense”, and I thank them for their advocacy on this issue. DairyNZ welcomed the new proposed legislation, saying it would lead to “[reduced] complexity, fewer consents, greater consistency, better use of farm plans,”. The primary sector’s success is critical to New Zealand’s prosperity, and we are unshackling them from burdensome and unnecessary regulation through these reforms.

Grant McCallum

National Party · Northland

What feedback has he seen from other important stakeholders?

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Minister responsible for RMA Reform

The New Zealand Planning Institute, who I have previously had remarks to say about, welcomed yesterday’s changes, saying, “We agree the system should get back to basics and focus on what’s important”—I welcome that—as well as “The results the Government is seeking will only eventuate if all actors involved … make changes to their approach to resource management”, and I agree. Driving a culture change through planners, councils, and resource management practitioners is critical, and I thank the Planning Institute for their leadership on this issue. I also want to highlight the comments made by the Environmental Defence Society, who, again, are not a group that I have necessarily been complimentary about in the past, and I do want to caveat that by saying that they have concerns about certain aspects of the bill, but they’ve also said, “There are bright spots … for example, existing water conservation orders are preserved … and new ones are still possible.” I think it would be fair to say yesterday that the feedback coming through is that basically everyone wants a better system. People acknowledge the Resource Management Act has failed. This is the biggest economic reform in a generation, and I’m proud to be getting on with it on behalf of the Government.

Question No. 4—Finance

4. Finance

Barbara Edmonds

Labour Party · Mana

to the Minister of Finance

Does she stand by her statement about the Government’s ownership interests in State-owned assets that “all advice will be taken to Cabinet and Cabinet collectively will make decisions”; if so, has she directed Treasury to start work on this Cabinet paper?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister of Finance

In answer to the first part of the question, yes, in the full context of my quote, which was “all advice will be taken to Cabinet and Cabinet collectively will make decisions about the ownership statements;”. As I said yesterday, Treasury advised in its briefing to incoming Ministers that most OECD countries already have ownership statements. New Zealand does not, and we should close that gap. Ministers have already agreed at Cabinet that that work should progress, and Treasury is preparing that advice for both the Minister for State Owned Enterprises and relevant Associate Ministers of Finance, or the Minister of Finance. We will then take that advice to Cabinet at some time in the new year, and, therefore, drafting has not yet commenced.

Barbara Edmonds

Labour Party · Mana

Why would she even consider taking a paper to Cabinet—a paper she describes as “basic financial stewardship”—if not for further discussion on asset sales?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister of Finance

Because we like to keep our Cabinet informed of the work that we are doing on financial stewardship, and we intend to update them on the work that we are doing, including any priorities for further work to enhance the performance of assets which we own.

Barbara Edmonds

Labour Party · Mana

Does she expect feedback on her Cabinet paper from the Rt Hon Winston Peters like his public statement: “Well, actually, just getting rid of assets built up by our forefathers to try and balance the books—that is an admission of potential failure before you even start”?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister of Finance

Well, I expect a lot more feedback from Mr Peters between now and the election, but I think some of his best feedback will be for that member and her leader, who, I believe, he is on the record for having some very, very strong feedback for.

David Seymour

ACT Party · Epsom

Can the Minister imagine being part of a Government—

Carmel Sepuloni

Labour Party · Kelston

Did you ask the Minister about what they are imagining?

David Seymour

ACT Party · Epsom

—where people were afraid to even—

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Just a moment—sorry, just a moment. We don’t call out, or anything else, while questions are being asked. That was a pretty egregious sort of intervention—just keep it quiet. Thank you. The Hon David Seymour will start again.

David Seymour

ACT Party · Epsom

Can the Minister imagine being part of a Government where people were afraid to even have a discussion about the purpose of owning assets?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister of Finance

Well, Mr Speaker, I’m tempted to repeat a quote that got me into trouble last week, which is “Those who are conspiracy theorists see conspiracy theory everywhere”.

Barbara Edmonds

Labour Party · Mana

Why is she taking asset sales to Cabinet when the Rt Hon Winston Peters has described it as a “failed economic strategy that Treasury has pushed for a long long time.”?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister of Finance

I am doing no such thing, and it is beneath the credibility of that member to repeat false claims.

Barbara Edmonds

Labour Party · Mana

Is she taking this matter to Cabinet just so she can get the Treasury to work on National Party policy to sell State assets in the next term?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister of Finance

I appreciate that the member prepared her questions in advance, but I have answered that question and addressed it directly, which is that the purpose is to inform members of the Cabinet on the work we have done to define ownership purposes and to see what further work may be required to enhance the performance of these commercial assets. So the member should stop mischaracterising our intention.

Question No. 5—Prime Minister

5. Prime Minister

Chlöe Swarbrick

Green Party · Auckland Central

Co-Leader

to the Prime Minister

E tautoko ana ia i ngā kōrero me ngā mahi katoa a tōna Kāwanatanga?

[Does he stand by all of his Government’s statements and actions?]

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Yes.

Chlöe Swarbrick

Green Party · Auckland Central

How can his climate Minister stand on the world stage and say that we are committed to keeping global warming below 1.5 degrees after his Cabinet had signed off on changes months ago to emissions targets that are consistent with Aotearoa New Zealand contributing to 2.7 degrees of warming, which the UN Secretary-General has described as “catastrophic”?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Well, again, what we are committed to doing is delivering on net zero 2050. We look at our emissions reduction plans, we look at our emissions reduction budgets, and it looks like we’re on track to do that. We may even do that a bit earlier.

Chlöe Swarbrick

Green Party · Auckland Central

Does he accept the official advice given to his Cabinet that his weakened methane target will double the emissions shortfall in emissions budget three, requiring other sectors of the economy and households to significantly increase their contributions and, therefore, costs to meet our targets?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

What I acknowledge is that we have the very best farmers in the world and we have the most carbon-efficient farmers in the world, and shutting down production in New Zealand, as the Labour-Greens Government plan to do, and shifting that production to somewhere else in the world only makes global greenhouse gas emissions worse.

Chlöe Swarbrick

Green Party · Auckland Central

Is the Prime Minister comfortable with the official advice that his Cabinet received that his decision to enable more super-heating methane emissions will increase the costs for all New Zealanders, who have to pick up the slack?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

What will increase the cost is shutting down farming in New Zealand and actually shifting that offshore and making every single man, woman, and child in this country poorer. We are not punishing our farmers, and we are not punishing New Zealanders. We’re proud of our farmers, who are the most carbon-efficient in the world, and, therefore, moving that production anywhere else other than New Zealand only makes greenhouse emissions worse, not better.

Chlöe Swarbrick

Green Party · Auckland Central

So does the Prime Minister intend to either miss the emissions budget out to 2035 by over 18 million tonnes as a result of the official advice that his Cabinet received on reducing methane emissions, or create additional costs of hundreds of millions of dollars for everyday New Zealanders through higher emissions trading scheme prices if we are not to miss that target?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Well, as I’ve said to the member, what we look for is delivery of our net zero 2050 goal. We take it budget by budget and emissions reductions plan by plan. There’s often more work to do in the outer years, obviously, but that’s coming into shape, and we’ve got efforts to do that. But we’re on track to deliver net zero 2050. We’re doing our part to make sure we’re doing it. I’m sorry to the member: we are not going to shut down farming in New Zealand. We are not sending that production overseas. That was the plan from Labour-Greens in the previous administration. It’s not this Government’s plan. We’re proud of the farmers. [Interruption]

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Just a minute.

Chlöe Swarbrick

Green Party · Auckland Central

Why would his Government reduce the methane target in line with contributing up to 2.7 degrees in global warming when the independent expert Climate Change Commission made clear, in their advice to Governments, that we could actually increase the ambitions of our climate targets, which would not only be completely compatible with his stated aims of economic growth but also reduce the risk of a far harsher and more costly transition in the future?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Quite simply, as I’ve said in my previous answers, we have the most carbon-efficient farmers in the world. We are not shutting down food production in New Zealand and shifting it to one of any of the other 195 countries in the world only to make global greenhouse gas emissions worse. We are proud of our farmers. They are the best in the world. They’re the most carbon efficient in the world. They’re embracing technology and innovation. We might be able to increase production and lower emissions at the same time, going forward.

Chlöe Swarbrick

Green Party · Auckland Central

Point of order, Mr Speaker. Not one of my questions asked about food production. In fact, all of them were about the mathematics of the Government meeting its emissions budgets, and the Prime Minister did not even address any of those questions.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

No. I’m sorry, I can’t agree with that. I think the questions—and Hansard will show—made assertions about what is likely to happen in the member’s opinion, and some advice that has been provided to the Government. The Government doesn’t have to accept that, and by putting the answers as the Prime Minister has, he’s explaining why they don’t accept it.

Question No. 6—Māori Development

6. Māori Development

Willie Jackson

Labour Party · List MP

to the Minister for Māori Development

Does he agree with Reikura Kahi, chairwoman of Te Māngai Pāho, that funding cuts to Te Māngai Pāho will be “catastrophic” for te reo Māori and the media sector; if not, why not?

Tama Potaka

National Party · Hamilton West

Minister for Māori Development

Tuatahi me mihi ka tika ki a Reikura me tōna momo e hāpai nei i tō tātou reo māhorahora.

[First it is appropriate to acknowledge Reikura and those like her who are promoting our monumental language.]

No, I do not agree with that statement. There are no funding cuts to Te Māngai Pāho. It is actually facing a fiscal cliff birthed by the previous Government who provided time-limited funding for Māori media. This Government has retained baseline funding for Māori media through Budget 2024 and Budget 2025 as part of our continued support for te reo Māori.

E mihi ana ki te Minita Pūtea.

[I acknowledge the Minister of Finance.]

Willie Jackson

Labour Party · List MP

To the Minister—

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Just wait.

Willie Jackson

Labour Party · List MP

How many jobs will be lost across Māori media as a result of a 25 percent funding cut to Te Māngai Pāho?

Tama Potaka

National Party · Hamilton West

Minister for Māori Development

Can I repeat my statement. There has been no funding cut. We have retained the baseline funding. The number of jobs is a matter for operational decisions across various Māori media organisations.

Willie Jackson

Labour Party · List MP

Does he agree with Whakaata Māori that “Whakaata Māori has proven it delivers unmatched cultural, social, and economic returns, yet we continue to be resourced at levels disproportionate to our proven impact.”; and if so, why won’t he fund Whakaata Māori accordingly and prevent further job losses in the sector?

Tama Potaka

National Party · Hamilton West

Minister for Māori Development

Whakaata Māori has produced some amazing talent and some amazing programmes like Hunting Aotearoa and Homai te Pakipaki, a great sing-song programme, and they continue to provide serious value for te reo Māori and across the identity of New Zealand. What I can say is this: a number of broadcasting entities that have been funded by Governments over time are facing very, very strong challenges by people on Facebook and Instagram and a whole range of content subscribers and producers, and I encourage Whakaata and others to maintain the agility and the nimbleness that they are well known for.

Willie Jackson

Labour Party · List MP

Has he met with long-time supporters of iwi radio and Māori media, the Rt Hon Winston Peters and the Hon Shane Jones, to discuss funding options of iwi radio and Māori media in the regions particularly, and if not, why not?

Tama Potaka

National Party · Hamilton West

Minister for Māori Development

There are a range of kōrero and conversations that I have with various Ministers, stakeholders, and others to ensure that we continue to support te reo Māori, but make no mistake: the survival and the health of te reo Māori is not dependent on the taxpayer or the Government. It is more dependent on whānau speaking, singing, doing haka, and making assertions in te reo Māori. Kia ora tātou.

Willie Jackson

Labour Party · List MP

Does he agree with the comments from associate finance Minister David Seymour that if he had it his way, “there would be even less funding for te Māngai Pāho.”; and if not, what advice, if any, did he give to Mr Seymour about the Government’s responsibilities under the Maori Language Act 2016?

Tama Potaka

National Party · Hamilton West

Minister for Māori Development

I am unaware of the quote that is attributed to the Deputy Prime Minister, but what I am aware of is the huge effort that the Deputy Prime Minister made at Waitangi last year to say his entire kōrero in te reo Māori, and I hope to see that again. Tēnā tātou katoa.

Question No. 7—Justice

7. Justice

Cameron Luxton

ACT Party · List MP

to the Associate Minister of Justice

What progress has been made towards reforming New Zealand’s firearms laws?

Nicole McKee

ACT Party · List MP

Associate Minister of Justice

This morning, the Arms Bill passed its first reading unanimously in this House and it’s on its way to the Justice Committee for public submissions. This bill has been five years in the making and responds to the rushed, knee-jerk laws passed in 2019. Those changes damaged the relationship between licensed firearm owners and Government. The Arms Bill will begin to rebuild that trust by removing impractical regulations, making compliance simpler, and focusing on broad public safety.

Cameron Luxton

ACT Party · List MP

What input has the community had in shaping the Arms Bill?

Nicole McKee

ACT Party · List MP

Associate Minister of Justice

The community has had extensive input into shaping the Arms Bill. Public consultation earlier this year received over 8,500 submissions containing more than 700,000 points of individual feedback. This input has been critical to ensuring that the bill is fit for purpose, reflects community expectations, and helps rebuild trust and confidence in our firearms network. The community will have an additional chance to provide input during the select committee process.

Cameron Luxton

ACT Party · List MP

What are the next steps for the Arms Bill?

Nicole McKee

ACT Party · List MP

Associate Minister of Justice

The Arms Bill has been referred to the Justice Committee for a full six-month process. After witnessing the consequences of a rushed three-day select committee in 2019, it is important that the bill receives proper scrutiny through a full select committee process. During this period, New Zealanders will again have the opportunity to make submissions and propose improvements, and I encourage everyone to have their say.

Cameron Luxton

ACT Party · List MP

Will there be opportunities for changes to be made to the bill?

Nicole McKee

ACT Party · List MP

Associate Minister of Justice

Absolutely. A bill is by no means fixed, once introduced. The Justice Committee will consider all public submissions and make recommendations, if needed. If we want an Arms Act that can endure for the next 40 years, it is essential that New Zealanders take the time to read the bill and make informed submissions over upcoming months.

Cameron Luxton

ACT Party · List MP

Has input from the hunting community shaped the Arms Bill?

Nicole McKee

ACT Party · List MP

Associate Minister of Justice

Most certainly. The hunting sector plays a vital role in managing introduced species and providing kai for New Zealanders. Hunters formed the largest group of submitters in this year’s consultation, representing 84 percent of all submissions. This reflects how important the bill is to those who rely on firearms for food gathering and sport. I encourage hunters across the country to engage through the select committee process and help shape how the tools of their trade are regulated.

Question No. 8—Education

8. Education

Willow-Jean Prime

Labour Party · List MP

to the Minister of Education

Does she stand by her statement that “what is not at question here is the importance of the Treaty of Waitangi”; if so, why did she remove the obligation for school boards to give effect to Te Tiriti o Waitangi?

Erica Stanford

National Party · East Coast Bays

Minister of Education

Yes, I stand by my statement that the importance of the Treaty of Waitangi is not in question. The Treaty was signed between Crown and iwi Māori, and the obligation for the Crown to uphold the Treaty in education is firmly established in section 32 and section 4 of the Education and Training Act. It was Cabinet’s view that the school boards are not part of the core Crown, and should not be delegated a legal requirement to give effect to the Treaty that rightly sits with the Crown. The obligations I rightly hold have driven a work programme that has been uncompromisingly ambitious for tamariki Māori and is now delivering results.

Willow-Jean Prime

Labour Party · List MP

Will she accept that a petition signed by 24,000 people shows she got it wrong?

Erica Stanford

National Party · East Coast Bays

Minister of Education

I was pleased to go out on the forecourt and meet with iwi chairs and Rahui Papa and accept the petition. The comments that I made there on the forecourt and also in a stand-up beside Rahui Papa afterwards on the tiles here in Parliament, were that—and he agreed—while sometimes we might disagree, we have exactly the same aspirations for tamariki Māori, and that is to raise achievement for all children across the country, especially tamariki Māori. I take that very seriously. Actually, I know that it hurts the Opposition that they couldn’t do it and that we are, but we are raising achievement for tamariki Māori for the first time in decades.

Willow-Jean Prime

Labour Party · List MP

Does 1,726 schools, 41 principals’ associations and collectives, and 725 early childhood centres saying they will uphold Te Tiriti show she got it wrong?

Erica Stanford

National Party · East Coast Bays

Minister of Education

No. We’re asking boards to be laser focused on getting kids to school, keeping them safe, and raising achievement. If those school boards, over and above those obligations—those legal obligations—wish to uphold the Treaty of Waitangi because they believe that it will improve student outcomes, then that is up to them; that is a choice that they can make. But having lists of schools that are put together by activists is not helpful.

Willow-Jean Prime

Labour Party · List MP

Why did she ignore her ministry when they told her to consult with Māori?

Erica Stanford

National Party · East Coast Bays

Minister of Education

It was Cabinet’s belief that we hold the Treaty obligations very clearly under the Education and Training Act, in section 32 and section 4; we hold those obligations. While I understand that the previous Government, in 2020, decided to delegate their obligation away to school boards, we do not believe that was the correct thing to do, and neither do the Crown. Unfortunately, if the previous Government had spent more time concerned about raising achievement and mathematics for tamariki Māori, rather than delegating away their core responsibility to school boards maybe, then, improvements would have been made for tamariki Māori. Unfortunately they weren’t, but they are under this Government because we take our obligation under the Treaty of Waitangi and the Education and Training Act very seriously.

David Seymour

ACT Party · Epsom

Does the Minister believe those improvements to the teaching of maths might avoid a situation where future generations of MPs think that 24,000 is a majority of 5.3 million?

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

This needs to be a very brief answer.

Erica Stanford

National Party · East Coast Bays

Minister of Education

. Of course, raising achievement in mathematics across the country is vitally important which is why we are seeing results—for the first time in decades—in mathematics results under this Government.

Willow-Jean Prime

Labour Party · List MP

Why wasn’t Te Puni Kōkiri given enough time to meaningfully consult on these changes?

Erica Stanford

National Party · East Coast Bays

Minister of Education

It comes back to the answer I already gave: there is already a very important Treaty obligation—in the Education and Training Act—that sits with the Crown. That is not in question; we are upholding it. Cabinet did not believe that it was a proper thing to delegate that obligation away to a school board.

Question No. 9—Prime Minister

9. Prime Minister

Marama Davidson

Green Party · List MP

Co-Leader

to the Prime Minister

E tautoko ana ia i ngā kōrero me ngā mahi katoa a tōna Kāwanatanga?

[Does he stand by all of his Government’s statements and actions?]

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Yes.

Marama Davidson

Green Party · List MP

When his Government proposed to give a near-blanket extension to all consents through to 2031, was any analysis done as to whether Ministers or MPs would benefit from this; if not, why not?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

In answer to the first question, we haven’t done that.

Marama Davidson

Green Party · List MP

Does he have confidence, then, that no Ministers or Government members hold consents that will benefit from these blanket extensions; and if so, on what basis?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

I have confidence that we manage our conflicts appropriately.

Marama Davidson

Green Party · List MP

How will communities living with polluted rivers, polluted lakes, and polluted drinking water benefit from delayed environmental controls as a result of the blanket extensions of consents to 2031?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

They’ll be wealthier.

Shane Jones

NZ First · List MP

Point of order. Sir, that’s the second question the House has been required to endure that is absolutely not consistent with Standing Order 390. Not only was a wild allegation made about members of this side of the House but then further unproven, reckless statements were permitted.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

No—there was most certainly an inference in a question, but not a wild allegation, and I think it was adequately answered in relation to the Cabinet Manual. As for the second part of the question, well, that’s a question that can be asked in the House, and the Prime Minister can choose, if it’s in the public good, to answer it.

Shane Jones

NZ First · List MP

Point of order. “Questions must be concise and not contain … inferences,”.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Yes, and so must answers, and if we had followed that dictum to the nth degree, then we’d have virtually no answers from the Government on anything.

Marama Davidson

Green Party · List MP

I’ll repeat my third question, Mr Speaker—it wasn’t answered. How will—

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

No, you won’t. You won’t repeat it, thank you. Have you got another supplementary?

Marama Davidson

Green Party · List MP

Does he think it’s hypocritical to claim he cares about ratepayers when the near-blanket extensions of all consents make a mockery of the time, effort, and resources put in by communities and councils to better protect the environment?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Well, actually, since the Resource Management Act (RMA) has been in existence, you could argue we, actually, have seen some environmental degradation, so it, arguably, hasn’t been working anyway. But what we are doing, on this side of the House, is we are disrupting the whole RMA process. We are not apologising for it; we want economic growth. We want New Zealanders to be wealthier. That’s what they’re going to get as a consequence of this RMA reform.

Chris Bishop

National Party · Hutt South

Can the Prime Minister confirm that the consent extensions that Marama Davidson is referring to are part of a pragmatic and practical transition to the new planning system and making it easier for that transition to take place?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Yes, and I want to say to that member: thank you very much for actually making sure there are concession upgrades, because the new regime will be infinitely better. Imagine a world where 46 percent less consents are needed—that’s a beautiful thing.

David Seymour

ACT Party · Epsom

Does the Prime Minister agree that faster consenting of infrastructure projects, such as the forthcoming waste-water tunnel from Newmarket Park to Ōrākei, can actually help reduce pollution, such as the intolerable amounts of E. coli in the Hobson Bay, as just one example of how better infrastructure is actually good for the environment, but it has been held back by the Resource Management Act, which is broken?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

I agree. I think we can get stronger environmental outcomes and better economic outcomes at the same time.

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Does the Prime Minister agree that delivering faster consents for renewable energy projects, such as wind farms and solar farms, has the dual impact of not only reducing emissions but also enhancing economic growth?

Christopher Luxon

National Party · Botany

Prime Minister

Absolutely, and that’s why I would hope that the Green Party would support these fantastic reforms.

Question No. 10—Education

10. Education

Katie Nimon

National Party · Napier

to the Minister of Education

What recent announcements has she made regarding school property?

Erica Stanford

National Party · East Coast Bays

Minister of Education

Today, I announced that we are continuing to supercharge school property. We’ve listened to the sector and as part of the first ever Ministry of Education tenure property plan, we are delivering a major increase to school capital funding so that our classrooms are well maintained. The Five Year Agreement (5YA), which covers upgrades, modernising or replacement works over a five-year period, will increase by 50 percent, and for our small schools, the minimum allocation will double from $45,000 to $90,000. This is the first increase in that FYA funding rate since 2010, and these changes are to give schools a greater certainty and flexibility to plan effectively and get on with more upgrades.

Katie Nimon

National Party · Napier

When can schools expect to benefit from this change?

Erica Stanford

National Party · East Coast Bays

Minister of Education

The first group of 450 schools will receive an increased funding from 1 July 2026. Each year, 20 percent of schools will receive their new 5YA budget. So over the next five years, all schools will receive the 50 percent uplift as their new budget lands. The investment will support planning and deliver larger essential upgrades and modernisations over the long term, and that doubling of the minimum allocation is particularly significant for the smallest schools, 24 of which will double their existing funding in the first year. I’d like to express my thanks to the Rural Schools Association for their ongoing advocacy for small rural schools.

Katie Nimon

National Party · Napier

What feedback has she received?

Erica Stanford

National Party · East Coast Bays

Minister of Education

Well, it’s been overwhelmingly positive, as you would expect. A rural principal said, “Thank you for your understanding of the realities of the rural context.” One principal emailed me to say, “What an outstanding Christmas announcement. This will have significant impact on upgrading our older buildings. Many thanks indeed for all of the great work you and your team are doing in both curriculum and capital works. It will be a world-class education system in the next while if, as a nation, we can keep this aspirational vision and strong leadership up.”

Katie Nimon

National Party · Napier

What other feedback has been received?

Erica Stanford

National Party · East Coast Bays

Minister of Education

Well, electorate MPs like Suze Redmayne for Rangitīkei who got in touch with their local schools also received great feedback which they’ve passed on to me. One principal said, “This is massive news and the timing is amazing for us with our next 5YA due to start next year. We save and contribute to our property project, so this extra funding means we’re going to be able to deliver even more property improvements for our students. Best news ever.” Another said, “It was great to open my emails this morning to the email from Erica. It will make a huge difference in what we’re able to do in our school.”

Question No. 11—Internal Affairs

11. Internal Affairs

Lemauga Lydia Sosene

Labour Party · Māngere

to the Minister of Internal Affairs

Does she stand by all of her statements and actions regarding Fire and Emergency New Zealand?

Brooke van Velden

ACT Party · Tāmaki

Minister of Internal Affairs

Yes, especially my statement last night following a meet and greet event with firefighters on the Parliament lawn. I thanked the firefighters and all first responders who worked tirelessly to bring the Tongariro fire under control over the past couple of days. I also thanked them for their dedication and service and hoped that they’re able to find some well-deserved rest over the coming days.

Lemauga Lydia Sosene

Labour Party · Māngere

Does she stand by her decision, in December 2024, requiring $60 million in cuts from the Fire and Emergency New Zealand (FENZ) budget at a time when firefighters say they don’t have the staff or equipment they need?

Brooke van Velden

ACT Party · Tāmaki

Minister of Internal Affairs

Yes, I do stand by that because that $60 million is very important because we know that when there was an amalgamation of the urban fire service and the rural fire service, people expected to see some form of efficiency gain. No efficiency gain was found, and it’s important, in any amalgamation, to try and find an efficiency, so we’re focusing on efficiency within the back office, but I would also note that that $60 million that I’ve been asking FENZ to save is not going to be returned to the Crown. It will stay within Fire and Emergency and will be able to be reinvested in Fire and Emergency. In fact, the only money from Fire and Emergency that has returned to the Crown is the $70 million Crown loan that levy payers are still on the hook for from when the former Minister of Internal Affairs got involved in collective bargaining.

Lemauga Lydia Sosene

Labour Party · Māngere

Does she stand by her decision to restrict Fire and Emergency New Zealand funding, given that professional firefighter Adam Wright estimates that there have been 800 fire truck breakdowns in Auckland alone over the past year?

Brooke van Velden

ACT Party · Tāmaki

Minister of Internal Affairs

When it comes to the fleet and management and maintenance, I’ve been given assurances from Fire and Emergency that there have not been any deferments of maintenance this year or in previous years under my term. But I’d also note that when it does come to the fleet, I’m advised by Fire and Emergency that the term of the settlement of the collective employment agreement between Fire and Emergency and the Professional Firefighters Union in 2022 was the establishment of three working parties—one of which was fleet. This saw Fire and Emergency and the Professional Firefighters Union at the table in equal numbers, working on solutions for the future of the organisation’s fleet. Since then, we have had many trucks on order.

Lemauga Lydia Sosene

Labour Party · Māngere

Why do members of Government boards deserve up to 80 percent pay rises while her offer to firefighters barely keeps up with inflation?

Brooke van Velden

ACT Party · Tāmaki

Minister of Internal Affairs

Those things are very, very different things. If you have governance of Crown boards, you need people who have good governance skills and strategic oversight who are in charge of hundreds of millions, if not billions, of dollars. New Zealand taxpayers expect that money to be used wisely and for there to be good strategy and oversight. When it comes to how Fire and Emergency is funded—and I would assume that the member should know this—it is not funded by taxpayers; it’s funded by levy payers. When we are setting the levy and when we are ensuring that Fire and Emergency can break even year on year, we need to ensure that people will reinsure their house content insurance, they will have reinsurance for cars, they will have content insurance, and that they will have commercial property insurance. That is what funds Fire and Emergency. If you set that too high, you have a higher likelihood of people not insuring and getting rid of the broad-based, low-rate component that funds the levy system. These are basic things, and they’re very different.

David Seymour

ACT Party · Epsom

Would the Minister care to answer the heckled question from Jan Tinetti as to why she is not inserting herself into the labour negotiations with the firefighters?

Kieran McAnulty

Labour Party · List MP

Point of order, sir. Well, one, Ministers should not be asking questions of their own which are clearly designed to have a crack at the Opposition; second of all, there’s a long-running convention that members cannot ask questions on behalf of other members.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

That’s very true, and the first point is that there is no prohibition on Ministers asking questions within their own party arrangements. The second point is that if you think about how the Hon David Seymour worded that question, he asked it in his own name, referencing where it had come from. That’s slightly different to what you’re asserting. The Minister responding can respond very, very briefly, given her very long answers so far.

Brooke van Velden

ACT Party · Tāmaki

Minister of Internal Affairs

I can give a very brief answer as to why I won’t be inserting myself into collective bargaining in the same way that the previous Minister did, because the previous Minister appointed the former president of the New Zealand Council of Trade Unions to oversee bargaining on her behalf during the process. She also appointed an independent facilitation mediator that made a recommendation for a settlement that Fire and Emergency didn’t have the necessary resources and financial requirements to settle. It required Fire and Emergency and the Minister to go to the Crown to ask for a loan that they’re still paying back.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

That was a new definition of brief. [Interruption] Hang on. Just a minute. Ask the question.

Lemauga Lydia Sosene

Labour Party · Māngere

Will she reconsider cuts to Fire and Emergency New Zealand’s specialist wildfire roles, given that since the cuts were announced, two major fires have broken out in Tongariro National Park?

Brooke van Velden

ACT Party · Tāmaki

Minister of Internal Affairs

There are no cuts to front-line firefighters.

Question No. 12—Housing

12. Housing

Sam Uffindell

National Party · Tauranga

to the Associate Minister of Housing

What recent announcement has he made on retirement villages?

Tama Potaka

National Party · Hamilton West

Associate Minister of Housing

I’ve recently announced proposed changes to the retirement villages framework that will improve transparency, clarity, and fairness for residents, including that when a resident moves out of a village, the operator will have to stop charging weekly fees and fixed deductions; clarity for the rules around chattels and fixtures; and an easy-to-access, independent dispute resolution scheme. For new residents, there will be a process to apply for early access to funds in hardship situations, interest being paid after six months if a unit remains unlicensed, and mandatory repayment of funds no later than 12 months after a unit is vacated.

Sam Uffindell

National Party · Tauranga

What changes are being made to improve fairness for existing and future residents?

Tama Potaka

National Party · Hamilton West

Associate Minister of Housing

For existing and future residents, there will be increased transparency that will level the playing field, enhance trust, and strengthen consumer confidence, which will both encourage investment and innovation in the sector. It will also give operators greater clarity around reinvesting in places like The Pavilion at Pacific Lakes Village in Pāpāmoa.

Sam Uffindell

National Party · Tauranga

How will the change support the retirement sector to grow and innovate?

Tama Potaka

National Party · Hamilton West

Associate Minister of Housing

There will be a greater degree of transparency and clarity for both residents and operators alike, and I want to acknowledge all those that have been involved in the process so far.

Sam Uffindell

National Party · Tauranga

What is happening next?

Tama Potaka

National Party · Hamilton West

Associate Minister of Housing

The Parliamentary Counsel Office will draft an amendment bill. [Interruption]

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Just a minute.

Tama Potaka

National Party · Hamilton West

Associate Minister of Housing

I expect to be able to introduce the amendment bill this parliamentary term. The select committee process will provide another opportunity for residents, whānau, and operators alike to have their say. Again, I acknowledge the Retirement Commissioner, Jane Wrightson, and a number of other individuals who have been involved in the process today. I expect they will contribute further as we move through the parliamentary stages.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Urgency is continued. I declare the House in committee for consideration of the Fast-track Approvals Amendment Bill.

In Committee

Bills

Fast-track Approvals Amendment Bill

Part 1 Amendments to Parts 1 and 2

Vote: Bills

Part 2 Amendments to schedules

Vote: Bills

Clauses 1 to 3

Vote: Bills

Third Reading

Vote: Bills

Animal Welfare (Regulations for Management of Pigs) Amendment Bill

Second Reading

TUESDAY, 9 DECEMBER 2025

(continued on Thursday, 11 December 2025)

Bills

Animal Welfare (Regulations for Management of Pigs) Amendment Bill

Second Reading

Vote: Bills

Part 1 Amendments to principal Act

Vote: Bills

Part 2 Related amendments to Animal Welfare (Care and Procedures) Regulations 2018, and Schedule 2

Vote: Bills

Clauses 1 to 3

Vote: Bills

Oral Questions

Questions to Ministers

Question No. 1—Justice

1. Justice

Oriini Kaipara

Te Pāti Māori · Tāmaki Makarau

to the Minister of Justice

Does he stand by the Government’s policy to ban enrolments in the final 13 days before an election, despite the Attorney-General warning that more than 100,000 people may be directly or indirectly disenfranchised by this proposal?

Paul Goldsmith

National Party · List MP

Minister of Justice

Thank you for the question. The answer is yes, and I’ve got every confidence that New Zealanders have the capability of responding to a change in the signal that is sent. They’ve got a year to get enrolled, and I’ve got every confidence that they will be able to get enrolled 13 days before the election.

Oriini Kaipara

Te Pāti Māori · Tāmaki Makarau

What impact will the prisoner voting ban have on wāhine Māori—Māori women—who are one of the most over-incarcerated groups in the world?

Paul Goldsmith

National Party · List MP

Minister of Justice

Well, if they’re imprisoned for more than three years currently, they don’t have a vote. After the legislation is passed, if they’re imprisoned after the passing of that legislation for less than three years, they will lose their vote. That’s about sending a clear message to those who are victims of crime that we take that seriously and there are consequences for crime, and one of those consequences is temporarily losing one’s vote while one is in prison.

Oriini Kaipara

Te Pāti Māori · Tāmaki Makarau

Does the Minister dispute evidence that shows that denying prisoners the right to vote undermines rehabilitation goals, increases social exclusion, and, ultimately, increases the risk of offending?

Paul Goldsmith

National Party · List MP

Minister of Justice

Well, of course, I tend to think more about the needs of the victims of crime who are trying to put their life together after having been bashed or stolen or murdered, or the many other victims of crime that live in this country. Look, we have a robust, strong democracy. There are many countries around the world that have various restrictions on prisoners voting. Currently, it is the law that if you’re in prison for three years or more, you lose your vote. We are extending that earlier, and we think that’s fully justified.

Oriini Kaipara

Te Pāti Māori · Tāmaki Makarau

Does his Government truly care about democracy, or do they only care about democracy when it can be—[Interruption]

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

No, hang on—wait on.

Oriini Kaipara

Te Pāti Māori · Tāmaki Makarau

—weaponised against Māori—[Interruption]

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Sorry, stop there.

Oriini Kaipara

Te Pāti Māori · Tāmaki Makarau

—such as when they remove the Māori wards—

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Stop—stop. The House will listen to a question in silence. Start again.

Oriini Kaipara

Te Pāti Māori · Tāmaki Makarau

Tēnā koe, Mr Speaker. Does the Minister’s Government truly care about democracy, or do they only care about democracy when it can be weaponised against Māori, such as when they removed Māori wards, dismantled co-governance, and introduced the Treaty principles bill?

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

OK, that question should be ruled out because it doesn’t comply with the requirements of the Standing Orders. However, in so much as the Minister is able to make a statement, he can.

Paul Goldsmith

National Party · List MP

Minister of Justice

Well, I can assure the House that this Government does care about democracy—very much so. The good news about democracy is that Governments are held to account, and we are perfectly willing to put our record before New Zealanders, particularly in the justice space, where we’ve seen 38—[Interruption]

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Just a moment. Things have to settle down. There are people just yelling for no particular purpose. They’re not interventions; they are just boorish barracking, and it’s got to stop. The Minister will briefly end his answer.

Paul Goldsmith

National Party · List MP

Minister of Justice

Well, I was just continuing about the virtues of democracy and the accountability and where we lay our performance before the people of New Zealand at the next election, and we’re very proud of the progress that we’ve made on many fronts.

David Seymour

ACT Party · Epsom

Can the Minister confirm that it’s actually a legal obligation to be enrolled to vote with an up-to-date address from the age of 18—[Interruption]

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

No—sorry, Minister Seymour. Someone called out then and interjected while a question was being asked. The question can be asked again, and you will be given the silence of the House.

David Seymour

ACT Party · Epsom

Can the Minister confirm it’s actually a legal obligation—one of the few blanket obligations that the law places on all New Zealanders—to be enrolled to vote with an up-to-date address from the age of 18 and so it shouldn’t be much of a problem to be enrolled 13 days before an election, and, if so, does he believe that New Zealanders of all races are equally capable of fulfilling this basic requirement?

Paul Goldsmith

National Party · List MP

Minister of Justice

Yes, and yes. I have always been troubled by a particular party claiming that their voters are disadvantaged by any changes, which would imply that their voters are less capable than other voters of getting themselves enrolled—which is a strange way to talk about your voters.

Question No. 2—Economic Growth

2. Economic Growth

Vanessa Weenink

National Party · Banks Peninsula

to the Minister for Economic Growth

What recent changes has the Government made regarding economic growth and supermarket competition?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister for Economic Growth

Last night, the Government passed amendments to the Fast-track Approvals Act. The changes streamline the fast-track process, making it more efficient and delivering important projects that will grow the economy. The changes also promote greater competition in the supermarket sector by speeding up consent and approval processes to get a new supermarket open. The Government is serious about lifting economic growth and getting a better deal for Kiwi shoppers. Our fast-track changes do both of those things.

Vanessa Weenink

National Party · Banks Peninsula

Why did the Government make changes to support supermarket competition?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister for Economic Growth

We heard loud and clear from a range of people that standard resource consent processes can hold new supermarkets back and tie them up in red tape for years. Restrictive zoning, slow consenting, and cumbersome regulations have caused widespread frustrations that have seen less choice and higher prices for Kiwi shoppers because of a lack of competition. The fast-track process will shorten the time required to gain consent for a new supermarket to just a few months, increasing grocery competition. This is good news for shoppers—it’s about saying yes.

Vanessa Weenink

National Party · Banks Peninsula

What else is the Government doing for supermarket competition?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister for Economic Growth

The Government’s focus is on regulatory enforcement and structural areas. Our work includes improving the Overseas Investment Act to better support grocery investments and amending the Commerce Act to better combat predatory pricing. We are also looking to trial the use of digital labels for lower-risk imported goods to reduce onerous food-labelling requirements on new supermarkets who seek to enter our grocery market, we have selected Christchurch City Council to be a single building consent authority to standardise decisions for grocery developments, and there is a wide range of other work under way, which, together, will help enhance grocery competition for shoppers.

Vanessa Weenink

National Party · Banks Peninsula

How will the changes to the Fast-track Approvals Act help grow the economy?

Nicola Willis

National Party · List MP

Minister for Economic Growth

The fast-track regime will support growth by kick-starting projects right across the country—projects that will create jobs and help lift the incomes of Kiwi families and communities. The Act is generally working well, with six projects already consented and three more expected to have decisions before Christmas. Over the past few months, expert panels and panel conveners, applicants, Government officials, and councils have identified areas where improvements could be made. Many of those were reflected in the changes made in this House last night. Officials estimate that the amendments could reduce the combined processing and consideration times by a further six weeks. That means more projects coming through the pipeline faster and that’s good for growth, and all those in this House who stand on the side of job creation and income growth should have voted for that bill.

Question No. 3—Women

3. Women

Carmel Sepuloni

Labour Party · Kelston

Deputy Leader

to the Minister for Women

Does she stand by all her statements and actions regarding women’s pay?

Nicola Grigg

National Party · Selwyn

Minister for Women

Yes, in the context they were given.

Carmel Sepuloni

Labour Party · Kelston

Why did she claim that Australia’s mandatory pay gap reporting system costs the Australian Government billions?

Nicola Grigg

National Party · Selwyn

Minister for Women

That was the number that I had been advised at the time. That has since been revised, and we understand the set-up costs of the Australian regulator were substantial; only to deliver very minimal gain.

Carmel Sepuloni

Labour Party · Kelston

What has changed since August 2023, when she said that she supported large companies being required to report on their gender pay gaps?

Nicola Grigg

National Party · Selwyn

Minister for Women

Nothing’s changed. I do support large companies registering their pay gaps, but we don’t believe in compulsion. In fact, we have a voluntary pay gap calculator, which has had 80,000 page visits and 11,500 unique visitors, and, as a result, we’ve seen the pay gap drop a full 3 percent to the lowest ever on record, at 5.2 percent.

Carmel Sepuloni

Labour Party · Kelston

What proportion of reduction in the gender pay gap is due to collective agreements or pay equity settlements?

Nicola Grigg

National Party · Selwyn

Minister for Women

I would have to get that question put on notice for the exact figure, but what I would say is that the representatives of those very hard-working union members who dutifully pay their levies to those union representatives really should start to try to utilise the new framework and raise claims again to prove that it works.

Carmel Sepuloni

Labour Party · Kelston

Is the chief executive of her ministry correct that at no point since the Government passed pay equity changes under urgency has she asked for or received advice from the Ministry for Women on pay equity?

Nicola Grigg

National Party · Selwyn

Minister for Women

Yes, she is correct.

Carmel Sepuloni

Labour Party · Kelston

Is she concerned that the chief executive of her ministry was unable to confirm her claim that changes to pay equity and cancelling 33 pay equity claims “can only be a good thing for women”?

Nicola Grigg

National Party · Selwyn

Minister for Women

I have absolute faith in the Chief executive of the Ministry for Women, but—as has been traversed ad nauseam in this House, but that member still does not seem to understand—pay equity and the pay gap cannot be conflated. There are multiple factors that go into the pay gap in New Zealand, and I’m explaining this slowly so that it might sink in.

Carmel Sepuloni

Labour Party · Kelston

Why, when, effectively, Pasifika women have been working for free since 9 October, Māori women since 18 October, Asian women since 25 October, and Pākehā women since 25 November, has she cancelled 33 pay equity claims, locked out secondary teachers from future pay equity claims, and won’t support mandatory gender pay gap reporting?

Nicola Grigg

National Party · Selwyn

Minister for Women

I have absolutely no responsibility for a number of those situations that that member has raised.

Question No. 4—Justice

4. Justice

Tom Rutherford

National Party · Bay of Plenty

to the Minister of Justice

How is the Government progressing with its plan to restore law and order? [Interruption]

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Just a minute. It’s pretty simple. If someone is asking a question, no one else is talking, and there was a lot of talking during Tom Rutherford’s question. [Interruption] No, we don’t want to hear it again, but it would be a good idea just to at least let the Minister start before deciding to commentate on his answer.

Paul Goldsmith

National Party · List MP

Minister of Justice

We’re making great progress. We had a target of reducing the number of victims of serious violent crime by 20,000. It’s already down by 38,000, but we know that there is a lot more work to do, and we don’t rest on our laurels for a moment because there are still far too many victims of crime. That’s why today’s Crimes Amendment Bill, which will have its first reading, will bring in a number of initiatives to ensure that criminals face stronger penalties for attacking first responders, for coward punches, for human trafficking, and for retail crime.

Tom Rutherford

National Party · Bay of Plenty

What will the Crimes Amendment Bill do?

Paul Goldsmith

National Party · List MP

Minister of Justice

It creates specific offences for assaulting first responders and prison officers, as committed to in the National - New Zealand First coalition, so that those who commit acts of violence against these people who rush towards danger to help their fellow New Zealanders will face greater consequences. It also fulfils the coalition commitment to create two new, specific coward punch offences, where people can be killed or suffer life-long injuries from these atrocious acts, and yet often the perpetrators receive lenient sentences. The Government is also seeking to strengthen trafficking and people-smuggling laws to stop criminals using loopholes to evade consequences that often affect the most vulnerable people.

Tom Rutherford

National Party · Bay of Plenty

What other changes will the Crimes Amendment Bill make?

Paul Goldsmith

National Party · List MP

Minister of Justice

There’s a number of areas in the retail space, which has been an ongoing—

Shane Jones

NZ First · List MP

Gangs, gangs.

Paul Goldsmith

National Party · List MP

Minister of Justice

Well, gangs have been dealt with in the previous legislation, Mr Jones, but in so far as they are connected with retail crime, they will suffer the consequences here, as well. Too often, business owners have been left feeling helpless as thieves walk out with whatever they please. We’ll clarify the citizen’s arrest powers so that if it’s safe and appropriate to do so, people can hold on to these offenders until the police arrive, and that will make a difference. It also introduces a new shoplifting regime with an instant fine to bring about swift consequences in that circumstance.

Tom Rutherford

National Party · Bay of Plenty

How will the Crimes Amendment Bill make a difference for victims?

Paul Goldsmith

National Party · List MP

Minister of Justice

The victims of retail crime will now have greater ability to hold those who steal from them—and not just from them but from their fellow law-abiding customers—to account by holding on to them until the police arrive, if it’s safe to do so, but also by bringing swift consequences through an infringement regime.

Tākuta Ferris

Independent · Te Tai Tonga

How has the Government progressed in 2025 with its plan to lower Māori overrepresentation in the justice system?

Paul Goldsmith

National Party · List MP

Minister of Justice

Very well, in the sense that we’re very much focused on the fact that Māori are overrepresented in the number of victims of crime. That is why we are very focused on reducing the number of victims of crime, which will have a bigger impact on Māori communities as they continue to be overrepresented as victims of crime. Everything we do in our Government is done to reduce the number of victims of crime—Māori, Pākehā, and every other ethnic group in this country.

Tākuta Ferris

Independent · Te Tai Tonga

Has the Minister’s focus on lowering the percentage of Māori as victims of crime had any impact on the Minister’s goal of lowering Māori overrepresentation in justice?

Paul Goldsmith

National Party · List MP

Minister of Justice

Well, yes, and that is the thing: if they’re more likely to be victims of crime, our reducing the overall number of victims of crime has a real impact and success for Māori, and when I go about the country—most recently, I was in Huntly, in an audience of, largely, Māori New Zealanders. They were pushing me to be even firmer on consequences for crime because they wanted to live in a safe community and they want their families to feel safe, and Māori are no different to any other New Zealanders in that desire. [Interruption]

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

I’ll make the point that the Minister doesn’t need the complementary support from his own side. He’s very capable of answering on his own.

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Can the Minister advise what progress has been made to restore real consequences for sexual violence?

Paul Goldsmith

National Party · List MP

Minister of Justice

Well, there’s been very significant progress in this area over the last three years. We brought back three strikes so that that very small number of perpetrators of serious sexual violence are kept out of circulation for longer; we’ve restricted the ability to have massive discounts on sentences so that those people who are convicted of serious sexual crimes actually face real consequences for those; we’ve changed the rules so that permanent name suppression is not available to adult sex offenders unless the victim agrees; we’ve brought in stalking legislation, which has been talked about for years, and that now sends a very clear signal to them; and we’ve ended the culture of excuses that was exemplified by funding cultural reports, which seemed to send the idea that it wasn’t your fault but it was somebody else’s fault for the crime that was perpetrated. I can’t think of another Government recently that has done more to make excellent progress in sending a very clear message around our society’s expectations on sexual violence.

Question No. 5—Disability Issues

5. Disability Issues

Priyanca Radhakrishnan

Labour Party · List MP

to the Minister for Disability Issues

Does she stand by her statement that the Government is committed to “breaking down barriers and improving the lives of disabled people”; if not, why not?

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Minister for Disability Issues

Yes, and that’s why we took immediate action to stabilise the disability support system and invested a record $2.1 billion funding boost to Disability Support Services (DSS) in the last two Budgets. That’s also why we’ve released the New Zealand Disability Strategy, which shows the measurable actions that we will take over the next five years to improve the lives of disabled New Zealanders. Whaikaha has also recently launched the first all-of-Government internship programme that will see a group of disabled people employed in the Public Service. Our Government is committed to improving the lives of disabled people and their families.

Priyanca Radhakrishnan

Labour Party · List MP

Why was the national Enabling Good Lives (EGL) leadership group downgraded such that it is no longer a ministerial advisory group?

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Minister for Disability Issues

I would disagree that it’s been downgraded. I’d like to actually quote from a letter that has been received just recently—just this week, in fact—from the chair of the EGL national leadership group. It says—and I quote—that they are “writing to express our appreciation to Whaikaha and the Ministry of Disability Issues and to Cabinet for formally acknowledging Enabling Good Lives as a foundation, touchstone, and guide within the New Zealand Disability Strategy”.

Priyanca Radhakrishnan

Labour Party · List MP

Why did the chief executive of Whaikaha tell a select committee during scrutiny week last week that the core relationship with the national EGL leadership group will no longer be with the Minister, but will be with the ministry?

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Minister for Disability Issues

Because that’s accurate, and, as I’ve just quoted from the chair of the EGL leadership group, they have acknowledged the work that is going on. I don’t agree that it’s downgraded; I think it’s a really important relationship, and, as I’ve said, the EGL principles are a cornerstone of our New Zealand Disability Strategy and are fundamental to not only the stabilising but the strengthening work of DSS.

Priyanca Radhakrishnan

Labour Party · List MP

Why did she choose to stop work on My Home My Choice, a programme that works on alternatives to residential care for disabled people?

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Minister for Disability Issues

That was a pilot initiative that was started by Whaikaha, and when we have focused our efforts on the disability support system, it is first about stabilising—and, as I said, we’ve invested a record $2.1 billion into Disability Support Services. Part of that—and the really exciting news in terms of what comes into effect in February next year with the changes we have made—is greater choice and control for disabled people, including for residential care. I’m surprised that that member isn’t celebrating a record investment and greater choice and control for disabled people, which is exactly the EGL principles.

Priyanca Radhakrishnan

Labour Party · List MP

Is she concerned that she has stopped My Home My Choice at a time when young people are increasingly being forced to live in aged-care homes because there aren’t any alternatives?

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Minister for Disability Issues

Well, I’m not sure that that member listened to the answer that I gave around the stabilisation and the strengthening of the disability support system, along with a record investment of $2.1 billion, which is all around how we ensure that the lives of disabled New Zealanders who access DSS have greater choice and control and that there also is a stable system that is fair and consistent throughout New Zealand.

Priyanca Radhakrishnan

Labour Party · List MP

What has she done about the increasing number of young disabled people living in aged-care homes, other than cutting the one programme designed to address the issue?

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Minister for Disability Issues

Well, I would reject that assertion, and I do agree that it is challenging for younger people who, because of a lack of access in the area they live, there is access to suitable residential care. But I would just put on record that that was a pilot. It was not across New Zealand; it was in a couple of locations, and what we need to do is to stabilise access to residential support, which is exactly what we’ve done. That’s why the record investment of $2.1 billion into DSS is so important, and the changes that come into effect in February next year give greater choice and control for disabled people in terms of where they live and how they live, and what services they access to support them.

Priyanca Radhakrishnan

Labour Party · List MP

How can she say that her Government is committed to improving the lives of disabled people when she’s taking away disabled people’s choice and control over where they live, she has withdrawn Government support for the EGL approach, and the disability unemployment rate is at an eight-year high?

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Minister for Disability Issues

Well, I absolutely reject the comments that that member has made, and I’m not sure that she listened to my answers in terms of how important the Enabling Good Lives principles are. It was a former National Government that introduced them in the first place, they are woven through the New Zealand Disability Strategy, and they are fundamentally at the heart of the changes we have made that come into effect on 1 February next year around flexible funding, which means there are zero—zero—purchasing guidelines, and total and absolute choice and control—

Priyanca Radhakrishnan

Labour Party · List MP

No one wants that, either.

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Minister for Disability Issues

—for disabled people. That member is saying that disabled people don’t want that—well, that’s not what they’re telling me. They want choice and control, and our Government is giving it to them.

Mariameno Kapa-Kingi

Independent · Te Tai Tokerau

How can the Minister claim the Government is breaking down barriers when the Whaikaha—Ministry of Disabled People annual report for the last financial year confirms significant data gaps for Māori disability outcomes and no clear funding breakdown for kaupapa Māori providers, leaving tangata whaikaha Māori without transparent accountability or targeted investment?

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Minister for Disability Issues

Well, I would say that, across many areas of Government, data needs to be improved in terms of the breakdown for Māori, and I’m happy to go away and have a look at what improvements we can make.

Mariameno Kapa-Kingi

Independent · Te Tai Tokerau

Why has the Government failed to set a clear timeline for closing the significant data gaps on accessibility and Māori-specific disability outcomes identified in the Whaikaha—Ministry of Disabled People annual report for the last financial year, and when will the Minister commit to delivering disaggregated data that enables targeted action for tangata whaikaha Māori?

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Minister for Disability Issues

Well, I would just say that our Government is focused on improving the lives of disabled New Zealanders from one end of the country to the other. As I’ve said, I’m happy to look at what improvements can be made around data, but our Government is absolutely focused on improving their lives.

Question No. 6—Tourism and Hospitality

6. Tourism and Hospitality

David MacLeod

National Party · New Plymouth

to the Minister for Tourism and Hospitality

What recent announcements has she made to support major events in New Zealand?

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Minister for Tourism and Hospitality

Last week, I announced the first tranche of events from our major events package. The line-up includes many exciting international and home-grown music acts, sports matches, and arts and cultural events kicking off in 2026. The first round is an integral part of the $70 million major events and tourism package designed to drive economic activity and confidence throughout the country. Tourism and major events are a crucial part of our Government’s focus on economic growth. More world-class events means more visitors, more jobs, and a growing economy.

David MacLeod

National Party · New Plymouth

What are the successful events?

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Minister for Tourism and Hospitality

The first tranche includes 20 events, and, amongst the highlights, American rockers Linkin Park will play in Auckland, the Ultra Music Festival brings its Miami-famous electronic dance music to Wellington, and our local legends Six60 are collaborating with Synthony for the very first time in Christchurch. In total, we will be supporting over 70 events either directly or indirectly through the Events Attraction Package and the Events Boost Fund. This is just the beginning. We’ll continue to set the stage for a massive year in 2026, and I’m looking forward to announcing other high-profile events in the new year.

David MacLeod

National Party · New Plymouth

What benefits does she expect to see as a result of this announcement?

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Minister for Tourism and Hospitality

When major events come to town, the economic ripple effect is huge. For every dollar spent on live performance, $3.20 is returned in benefits to the wider community. We know it’s looking positive, with the latest visitor stats showing an increase of 22,500 visitors in October 2025 compared to a year before. Events don’t just bring more visitors and economic benefits; they bring life and energy to our cities, creating vibrant communities and unforgettable experiences. That’s why we’ve invested in an exciting calendar of events designed to strike a chord with everyone.

David MacLeod

National Party · New Plymouth

What feedback has she seen on this announcement?

Louise Upston

National Party · Taupō

Minister for Tourism and Hospitality

The feedback has been incredibly positive. David Higgins from Duco Events has said, “Having support from the Government is very helpful. It enables us to confidently go big and put on massive shows that otherwise might not happen, and it makes New Zealand a nice place to live.” The Otago Rally organiser, Roger Oakley, was ecstatic, and said, “We’re heading into the 50th anniversary event for the Otago Rally next year and this funding will help us to bring it to the next level—something this remarkable milestone deserves.” New Zealand has an excellent global reputation for delivering world-class events, and I’m looking forward to announcing even further events in the coming months.

Question No. 7—Māori Development

7. Māori Development

Teanau Tuiono

Green Party · List MP

to the Minister for Māori Development

Is he concerned by the warnings of the United Nations Committee on the Elimination of Racial Discrimination that New Zealand is at serious risk of weakening Māori rights and entrenching disparities for Māori, and, if so, what is he doing to address these warnings?

Shane Reti

National Party · Whangārei

Minister for Pacific Peoples

on behalf of the Minister for Māori Development: The Government takes its international human rights obligations seriously and remains committed to ensuring equitable outcomes for Māori. We acknowledge the concerns raised by the United Nations Committee on the Elimination of Racial Discrimination—CERD—and we’ll continue to engage constructively with the committee through a regular reporting process. Te Puni Kōkiri are contributing to the cross-Government response to CERD’s concluding observations, which is led through the Ministry of Justice.

Teanau Tuiono

Green Party · List MP

What will he do to address the concerns of the Committee on the Elimination of Racial Discrimination that many of the Government’s policies, including scrapping Te Aka Whai Ora and budget cuts to Māori services—and I quote—“may seriously risk weakening the legal, institutional and policy framework for the implementation” of the racial discrimination convention?

Shane Reti

National Party · Whangārei

Minister for Pacific Peoples

As I said in my primary response, the ministry is working through the concluding observations, but as it relates to the Māori Health Authority, I’d also note that the committee recommended established bodies composed of Māori and Pacific health experts; the Hauora Māori Advisory Committee is exactly that.

Teanau Tuiono

Green Party · List MP

Does he agree with Lady Tureiti Moxon that this report is “unprecedented in its length and its language” and “CERD is clear: New Zealand is moving backwards on racial equality, and Māori rights are under serious threat.”, and, if not, why not?

Shane Reti

National Party · Whangārei

Minister for Pacific Peoples

No, I do not, and I enjoyed the conversation with her this time last week.

Teanau Tuiono

Green Party · List MP

Is he embarrassed that unlike the last review, this report finds virtually no positive progress by New Zealand on Māori rights or racial equality?

Shane Reti

National Party · Whangārei

Minister for Pacific Peoples

No. I’m pleased by the positive recommendations that the report does resolve to, including noting the initiatives taken by the New Zealand Police to address systemic bias in policing practices, and the increase in the number of Māori judges in the District Courts.

Teanau Tuiono

Green Party · List MP

Have any Government policies worsened outcomes for Māori?

Shane Reti

National Party · Whangārei

Minister for Pacific Peoples

Our ambitions are to improve the outcomes and improve equitable positions for Māori.

Shane Jones

NZ First · List MP

Is the Minister aware that a number of the people who sit on these UN pettifogging committees come from countries with far worse race relations—

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

No, hang on—hang on. Wait—

Shane Jones

NZ First · List MP

—problems than New Zealand?

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

You can have a go at asking the question again without the sort of emoluments in it that rule it slightly out of the Standing Orders—as the member himself has pointed out to me in recent days.

Shane Jones

NZ First · List MP

Thank you for that elucidation—

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

It’s an opportunity. Carry on.

Shane Jones

NZ First · List MP

Is the Minister aware that a number of the people that sit upon the United Nations committee hail from nations who have their own race relations problems that are worse than in our nation State of New Zealand?

Shane Reti

National Party · Whangārei

Minister for Pacific Peoples

As I said in my primary answer, I acknowledge that we have work to do and we have a process to do that, and I believe other members of the committee also have issues that they’re trying to work through also.

Paul Goldsmith

National Party · List MP

Is the Minister aware that the Minister of Justice had an extensive and constructive conversation with members of the committee over the course of their inquiry, and pointed out many of the areas where this Government is making excellent progress in advancing outcomes for Māori?

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

That’s great—now, where’s the question.

Paul Goldsmith

National Party · List MP

Is he aware—is he aware?

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Yeah, I know—well, good. Are you aware?

Shane Reti

National Party · Whangārei

Minister for Pacific Peoples

I am aware. I am aware of the—

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

That’ll do then. That’s fine.

Shane Reti

National Party · Whangārei

Minister for Pacific Peoples

—CERD process that the Ministry of Justice has.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

No, that’s fine.

Teanau Tuiono

Green Party · List MP

Does he accept the finding that the Government’s efforts to remove Treaty clauses from legislation—and I quote—“risk entrenching historical, structural, and systemic discrimination against Māori.”, and, if so, will the Government finally leave Te Tiriti o Waitangi alone?

Shane Reti

National Party · Whangārei

Minister for Pacific Peoples

What I accept is that concerns of this nature as expressed by CERD are being worked through by the Ministry of Justice, which has the lead, and we remain committed to reducing inequalities and to having better outcomes for Māori.

Question No. 8—Universities

8. Universities

RYAN HAMILTON

National Party · Hamilton East

to the Minister for Universities

What recent announcement has he made about the Waikato Medical School?

Shane Reti

National Party · Whangārei

Minister for Universities

Last week, myself and the Minister of Health, the Hon Simeon Brown, announced that construction is now under way on Waikato’s new medical school. With $82.85 million in Government funding, this new school represents a major long-term investment in medical education across the Waikato region and New Zealand and it will change the medical education landscape. It’s an exciting development and a major milestone in the Government’s plan to train more GPs. This Government is focused on fixing the basics and I’m proud to see the construction start on this exciting new school, and I want to acknowledge the many people over many years who have nourished this vision.

Ryan Hamilton

How will the new school strengthen medical education in New Zealand?

Shane Reti

National Party · Whangārei

Minister for Universities

We are building for the future, and this new school will help develop the health workforce New Zealand needs. From 2028, the Waikato medical school will train an additional 120 doctors each year, making the medical school one of the most significant workforce investments in a generation. The school’s teaching model places particular emphasis on primary care and rural GPs—areas that are currently challenging. It’s a good example of how universities are working to align students’ skills with the needs of the country, and it will provide a significant boost to tertiary education, as well as creating opportunities for the local workforce.

Ryan Hamilton

How will this approach strengthen primary care in New Zealand?

Shane Reti

National Party · Whangārei

Minister for Universities

This new school supports the Government’s clear focus on strengthening primary care, especially for regional New Zealand. Providing access to medical education locally means students can train closer to home, while helping build a resilient, regionally connected workforce. After their first year on campus in Waikato, students will spend three years undertaking clinical placements in a regional or provincial setting. Under a wider “train in place, stay in place” model, these trainees are more likely to then live and work in the regions, and this will help people see a doctor more easily and will improve the distribution of doctors across the country.

Ryan Hamilton

What feedback has he seen about the new school?

Shane Reti

National Party · Whangārei

Minister for Universities

I have received positive feedback from academics, practitioners, and some of the parents of the over 300 New Zealand citizens currently training in Australian medical schools. The Waikato Chamber of Commerce expressed their support for the school, highlighting its transformative potential. The Rural Health Network expressed delight with the announcement of a third medical school. The message from throughout the country is clear that this new medical school is a game-changer.

Question No. 9—Veterans

9. Veterans

Greg O'Connor

Labour Party · Ōhāriu

to the Minister for Veterans

Is he committed to ensuring that veterans receive their full entitlements from the Crown following the High Court rulings on Tā Harawira Gardiner’s case; if not, why not?

Judith Collins

National Party · Papakura

Attorney-General

on behalf of the Minister for Veterans: Yes.

Greg O'Connor

Labour Party · Ōhāriu

Will he rule out any legislative change that will override the High Court’s ruling on veterans’ entitlements; if not, why not?

Judith Collins

National Party · Papakura

Attorney-General

On behalf of the Minister, the Government is carefully considering its response. We need to fully understand the impact on claims before making a decision, and I’m not in a position to rule any response in or out.

Greg O'Connor

Labour Party · Ōhāriu

Does he agree that when the High Court has twice clarified how Veterans’ Affairs should be deciding veterans’ claims, any attempt to relitigate or legislate to narrow veterans’ rights would be an act of bad faith towards those who have risked their lives for New Zealand?

Judith Collins

National Party · Papakura

Attorney-General

Well, I think it’s very important to allow the Government to do its job, just as the previous Government had to wrestle with exactly the same issue when it also appealed against the decision of the Veterans’ Entitlement Appeal Board. I think it is a very serious issue, and the Government is taking it seriously. The Minister will of course, as a very astute and careful Minister, put his best efforts into this.

Greg O'Connor

Labour Party · Ōhāriu

Why do veterans who have been injured or who have died from having served their country—and their families—have to repeatedly go to court to receive the care and support they’re entitled to?

Judith Collins

National Party · Papakura

Attorney-General

Well, the member might wonder why the previous Government also appealed the decision. I think what is very important to understand is that—[Interruption] Just calm down. I think it is very important for this to be taken seriously, as the previous Government had to, and to consider all the implications of this. It’s a very serious matter and the Government is carefully considering its response—and instead of getting excited about it, just wait, listen, and work with the Government.

Greg O'Connor

Labour Party · Ōhāriu

What does he have to say to all those veterans and their whānau who have been declined support as a result of an interpretation of the Act which Justice Grau described as “the very opposite of benevolence and instead appears to be about resources.”?

Judith Collins

National Party · Papakura

Attorney-General

I’d say that it’s a good thing that this Government is in charge, and not the previous one. Since the High Court’s decision, Veterans’ Affairs has been processing claims in line with the court’s interpretation, and additional funding was made available in Budget 2025 to do this—not something that had happened under the previous regime.

Greg O'Connor

Labour Party · Ōhāriu

Does the Minister realise that to qualify for veterans’ support, a veteran must have served in a war zone?

Judith Collins

National Party · Papakura

Attorney-General

Well, I’d just suggest that that member not try and tell his grandma how to suck eggs.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

That could be described as a scrap between the grandparents, but—

Judith Collins

National Party · Papakura

Attorney-General

I’m sure you and I would never have such an argument.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Lucky it’s Christmas!

Question No. 10—Energy

10. Energy

Scott Willis

Green Party · List MP

to the Minister for Energy

Is he confident in the viability of the offshore wind industry in Taranaki?

Simon Watts

National Party · North Shore

Minister for Energy

Yes.

Scott Willis

Green Party · List MP

Is the decision of JERA Nex bp Ltd—a company registered in England and Wales, which was intending to build a 500 megawatt to 1 gigawatt of offshore wind farm in South Taranaki Bight—to withdraw from operations in New Zealand a sign of the good health of the industry?

Simon Watts

National Party · North Shore

Minister for Energy

Well, the entity that has been referred to is owned by BP and it is based out of the UK. Investment decisions are matters for individual companies. I am confident that offshore wind in New Zealand is viable. The Government is committed to creating a regime to support offshore wind, and we’re taking significant steps to make that a reality.

Scott Willis

Green Party · List MP

Point of order, Mr Speaker. I seek leave to table a letter from JERA Nex bp Ltd to me, confirming their intention to cease operations in New Zealand from the end of 2025.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Leave is sought. Is there any objection to that course of action? There appears to be none.

Document, by leave, laid on the Table of the House.

Scott Willis

Green Party · List MP

What are the implications for the offshore wind industry, with Taranaki Offshore Partnership indicating that the planned seabed-mining operation would make offshore wind in the area unfeasible, and BlueFloat, already having withdrawn from New Zealand, citing Trans-Tasman Resources’ seabed-mining as a leading reason?

Simon Watts

National Party · North Shore

Minister for Energy

Well, I’m very happy to help the member with a little bit of positive news in regard to developments in the offshore wind area. Only a week ago, Genesis and the entity which the member just noted—Taranaki Offshore Partnership—have entered into a memorandum of understanding to explore offshore wind development in New Zealand. More electricity generation has been commissioned in the past 18 months by this Government than in the entirety of the last 15 years, and so if the member wants a little bit of advice: support the Resource Management Act reform, support fast track, and make sure he supports liquefied natural gas.

Scott Willis

Green Party · List MP

Is he aware of the submissions from the offshore wind developers on the Trans-Tasman Resources seabed-mining fast-track application showing the incompatibility of seabed mining and offshore wind, and does the failure of the fast-track panel to seek comment from him, as Minister for Energy, indicate a significant failing of the fast-track regime?

Simon Watts

National Party · North Shore

Minister for Energy

Again, I’d be very happy to send the member a copy of a press release that I issued probably a couple of months ago, I think, in regard to decisions by this Government to draft an amendment to deal with the reality that we are going to be undertaking offshore exploration in conjunction with undertaking offshore wind, and making sure that those two economic growth opportunities for this country can coexist in the Taranaki region. This Government wants economic growth, we are looking to enable that through an amendment, and that’s currently being worked through.

Scott Willis

Green Party · List MP

Does the over six-month delay in passing the Offshore Renewable Energy Bill, and the withdrawal of yet another offshore wind developer, mean that the Minister for Energy has capitulated to the Minister for Resources, and offshore wind energy is simply dead in the water under this Government, which is instead prioritising seabed-mining?

Simon Watts

National Party · North Shore

Minister for Energy

No. The reality is that this is a very busy Government. We’ve got a significant work programme under way. As I noted, we are currently drafting the Amendment Paper required to deal with the exclusivity issue that the member has noted and the industry has noted, and I will reinforce again that if the Green Party really wanted to see more renewable energy in this country, then they would support fast track.

Scott Willis

Green Party · List MP

Will the Minister be renaming the Electrify NZ programme the “Mining NZ programme” on the basis of his Government’s actually revealed priorities?

Simon Watts

National Party · North Shore

Minister for Energy

No.

Question No. 11—Agriculture

11. Agriculture

DAVID WILSON

NZ First

to the Associate Minister of Agriculture

What recent announcements has the Minister made regarding the wool sector?

Mark Patterson

NZ First · List MP

Associate Minister of Agriculture

On Monday, I had the privilege to announce and attend the completion of the first commercial consignment of deconstructed woollen particles at Wool Source’s facility at Lincoln University. It is a shipment now bound for Japan for use in haircare products, showcasing this revolutionary new process, supported by $3.5 million in funding through the Ministry for Primary Industries.

Dr David Wilson

Why are these announcements significant for the wool industry?

Mark Patterson

NZ First · List MP

Associate Minister of Agriculture

Deconstruction of wool and fibre technology is the moonshot for the New Zealand wool industry. Deconstructing woollen pigments, particles, and powders into bioagents for inks, dyes, and nutraceuticals takes wool on to a whole new commercial playing field. It has the potential to capture very high returns and support much higher farm-gate returns, and, importantly, it has the potential to scale up and take significant quantities of New Zealand wool. Importantly, this world-leading technology has been developed by WRONZ—the Wool Research Organisation of New Zealand—at Lincoln University, and the intellectual property is owned by New Zealand farmers and the industry.

Dr David Wilson

What other initiatives are currently under way in the wool sector?

Mark Patterson

NZ First · List MP

Associate Minister of Agriculture

One of my priorities has been re-establishing mandated leadership for the wool sector. Since the demise of the Wool Board and the industry levy in 2011, the sector has been fragmented, lacking coordination and leadership. The Wool Alliance has been formed to explore an enduring industry model: a collaborative initiative designed to develop a sustainable, long-term industry model. The alliance brings together Wool Impact, Campaign for Wool New Zealand, and the Wool Research Organisation of New Zealand, with support from Beef + Lamb New Zealand, and it is chaired by John Monaghan, a former chairman of Fonterra. I’m pleased to report that farmer and industry consultation is under way, with the aim of having a formal structure formalised by the end of June 2026.

Dr David Wilson

What have been the highlights of the wool sector in 2025?

Mark Patterson

NZ First · List MP

Associate Minister of Agriculture

Look, the ultimate highlight and result has been the increase in the wool price, which is up 25 to 40 percent—depending on the micron—year on year as there is a return to natural fibres and woollen products. A particular highlight—and I must acknowledge the Hon Nicola Willis, as well—was the Government’s announcement to preference woollen fibres in Government buildings. It has been well received by farmers, by industry, and by the public, and it has attracted international recognition. But the greatest reward for me has been witnessing the revival of the sector, with the return of pride for our wool growers and our industry and a sense of collaboration and purpose, and they are able to see investment starting to flow back into this sector, with the knowledge that their Government is right behind them.

Jenny Marcroft

NZ First · List MP

Can the Minister confirm that he has set a high “baa” for the wool industry?

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

Well, next minute you’ll be asking him to demonstrate, and so we’ll just move on.

Question No. 12—Vocational Education

12. Vocational Education

Shanan Halbert

Labour Party · List MP

to the Minister for Vocational Education

Will Industry Skills Boards be able to carry out their full mandate from 1 January 2026; if not, why not?

Penny Simmonds

National Party · Invercargill

Minister for Vocational Education

The industry skills boards (ISBs) will be operational from 1 January 2026. The governance boards are in place now. They are currently going through the process of appointing chief executives and making offers to appropriate staff from the workforce development councils (WDCs). They will certainly be operational from 1 January 2026, but, like any new organisation, they will build capacity and capability as they evolve and progress. But, importantly, they have a very clear expectation of what their core functions are and what is most important for them to concentrate on early.

Shanan Halbert

Labour Party · List MP

Has she or any of the agencies she is responsible for provided the Minister of Education with advice on the feasibility of the industry skills boards being able to deliver on their role in replacing NCEA?

Penny Simmonds

National Party · Invercargill

Minister for Vocational Education

Well, of course, replacing NCEA and undertaking curriculum development for the compulsory sector is not a core part of the ISBs’ business, but, of course, we are incredibly supportive of the excellent work that Minister Stanford is doing to progress vocational pathways in schools, and we look forward to ISBs contributing positively to that work. While ISBs have a smaller number of core functions, it’s always been anticipated that there’ll be additional functions from time to time, like supporting the schools’ vocational pathways, researching apprentice success, and other specific industry initiatives. They’ll be undertaken as additional funding is made available for those tasks.

Shanan Halbert

Labour Party · List MP

Will industry skills boards need more funding and assistance to deliver on their part of the Government’s plan to replace NCEA?

Penny Simmonds

National Party · Invercargill

Minister for Vocational Education

Well, I’ll just repeat some of the things that I’ve said in the previous answer, which is that they have core functions that they are core-funded for, and there will be other initiatives from time to time, like supporting the vocational pathways that Minister Stanford is doing such a wonderful job in bringing forward. We are delighted to be able to be part of that very positive work to ensure that there are pathways. There’ll be other functions and other initiatives—such as the research we’d like them to do on the success of apprenticeships—and there’ll be other workforce initiatives that industries will want, and we will do those from time to time when funding is available for those initiatives.

Shanan Halbert

Labour Party · List MP

Has anyone who will be on an industry skills board raised concerns with her around their ability to design curriculum with less funding and less staff compared to the workforce development councils?

Penny Simmonds

National Party · Invercargill

Minister for Vocational Education

Well, of course, the workforce development councils didn’t develop curriculum for the compulsory schooling sector either, and there will be less funding available for the ISBs than the WDCs, but I have high expectations of them being more efficient than the WDCs were. So, again, there will be the core functions that they will undertake from their core funding, and then there may be additional functions from time to time, with additional funding.

Shanan Halbert

Labour Party · List MP

Why has she done nothing to help ensure that industry skills boards will be able to deliver as part of the Government’s plan to replace NCEA?

Penny Simmonds

National Party · Invercargill

Minister for Vocational Education

Well, that’s interesting, because I’ve done a considerable amount to ensure there are boards in place, there are chief executives being appointed, and there are staff being appointed, and we are working closely with Minister Stanford in the wonderful work that she is doing on vocational pathways. We look forward to the ISBs being able to support those pathways from compulsory schooling into tertiary education.

Shanan Halbert

Labour Party · List MP

Did she have any input in industry skills boards being part of the NCEA replacement, or was she just told that it was happening?

Penny Simmonds

National Party · Invercargill

Minister for Vocational Education

Of course I had input into it. There were core functions that were set, and then we knew that from time to time there would be additional functions. We are not only pleased to be involved in it but we are absolutely delighted because what it means is there is now a pathway from secondary schooling into vocational education through the vocational pathways. It’s to enable a seamless movement, and so we’re delighted to be part of that initiative.

Gerry Brownlee

Speaker

That concludes oral questions. Members who have other duties that take them out of the House should leave the House quickly and quietly, with no conversations on the way.

Bills

Animal Welfare (Regulations for Management of Pigs) Amendment Bill

Third Reading

Vote: Bills

Crimes Amendment Bill

First Reading

Vote: Bills

Instruction to Justice Committee

Vote: Bills

Public Works Amendment Bill

First Reading

Vote: Bills

Instruction to the Transport and Infrastructure Committee

Vote: Bills

Electoral Amendment Bill

Second Reading

Vote: Bills

Part 1 Amendments to Electoral Act 1993, and Schedule 1

Vote: Bills

TUESDAY, 9 DECEMBER 2025

(continued on Friday, 12 December 2025)

Bills

Electoral Amendment Bill

In Committee

Debate resumed.

Bills

Electoral Amendment Bill

Part 2 Amendments to other legislation

Vote: Bills

Clauses 1 and 2

Vote: Bills

Climate Change Response (2050 Target and Other Matters) Amendment Bill

First Reading

Vote: Bills

Second Reading

Vote: Bills

Part 1 2050 target for biogenic methane emissions reduction

Vote: Bills

Part 2 Other amendments

Vote: Bills

Clauses 1 to 3

Vote: Bills

Third Reading

Vote: Bills

Overseas Investment (National Interest Test and Other Matters) Amendment Bill

Part 1 Amendments to Overseas Investment Act 2005

Vote: Bills

Part 2 Consequential amendments

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Clauses 1 and 2

Vote: Bills

Third Reading

Vote: Bills

Judicature (Timeliness) Legislation Amendment Bill

Recommittal

Vote: Bills

In Committee

Vote: Bills